Julie's question

Harlot · Sep 11, 2003

Damn, I can't believe my thread ended up here, what happened?! Anyways, I've pretty much decided that the agency route is not for me. I know that some of you think that 400-500 for an hour is asking way too much, that I've set my expectations too high and that I must be kidding myself. So I'm just not going to do it. Because I know what I'm worth. And I hope noone tries to give me any of that "you don't determine what you're worth, the market does" bullshit. If noone's interested in paying my price then I'm not for sale.

And I still can't believe these girls do what they do and get to keep so little for themselves. I just think it's really yucky.

Cloud Nine · Sep 11, 2003

My worst fears are now realized of what hookers think of me...

Captain Kirk · Sep 11, 2003

Depends on you and her. With some girls if Mr Happy is really big and/or pound her for 20 min then she'll probably not be able to go another round. Based on my experience though 80% will let you CFS 2x/hr

********* · Sep 11, 2003

If you believe that what price you put for selling ass determines your self worth, you shouldn't be working in the sex industry. Pricing goes accordingly with the market and services.

Why ask for advice if you're not open enough to digesting it. You would think getting banned for being a selfish egotistical brat would have given you the opportunity for some reflection and emotional growth however I see you're still all about $you $you $you.

Thorn · Sep 11, 2003

He can't. JAG is a paid board and you have to be a member to read the thread mentioned.

Its easy enough to find it if you want info on how to become a member, etc.

Captain Kirk · Sep 11, 2003

Surely someone could yank a few passages and drop them here.

Thorn · Sep 11, 2003

I never said $400-$500 is too much. I said that for that money you have to either work for a very high end agency, whose hiring standards are going to be very because they can be; or you have to do it yourself and be very good at marketing yourself to the slice of the market that pays that kind of money.

That is what I said.

And, btw: Yucky, like many other things, is decidely in the mind of the beholder.

P.S.: If you don't want to do it then the only right choice is not to do it. So good for you for deciding that.

VV · Sep 11, 2003

You won't hear it from me.....

I've seen you and your more than worth that price.

And I've told this to all my friends in this business... You're worth whatever YOU think your worth. Whether or not you get any clients at your price is a different story.

pswope · Sep 11, 2003

d-u
Because of the past thuggery engaged in by certain julieites,I reluctantly respond to your post.

The factual basis for what I posted came from 3 ladies,whom I knew for a long time. 2 were working girls and the other a phone lady,all of whom worked at Julie's. The context of our seperate conversations led me to believe that none of them had an axe to grind. I stand by what I posted based upon the aformentioned. I will say and should have said that these conversations happened over 2 years ago. Maybe things have changed.
Commercial sex is an ugly business and I have serious problems with the attempts to paint it as some sort of bona fide hobby activity similiar to hanging out at a bar,watching a ball game and playing darts. I have no axe to grind with Julie because the conduct discussed there goes on in some fashion at most brothels and agencies.
For the same reason, I used the word "trick". I am a "trick" and it is in the context of commercial sex as disparaging as 'hos'.I've have conversed with many working girls,including net and brothels girls,who in moments of letting their guards down referred to their revered clients as "tricks".
There was no intent to either disparage Julies nor the guys who patronize the place. The endless debate about this place is tiresome and boring. I will not be drawn into it any further.

Please consider the context of my post. It was directed to a query made by a stripper,who to me is obviously conflicted and now is mulling becoming a working girl. It is palpable that she is not cut out do it and unlike others has options. Like the juvinile deliquents,who went to Rahway to get "scared straight", I naively tried the same. It was clearly a waste of time.

littleguy · Sep 11, 2003

*I* took the request about "B" to mean at Julie's. Hence, I said " no "B"".

(OTOH, if he didn't mean "at Julie's", then there certainly is a rather notorious(?) "B" there (grin) I got the impression that C.K. is rather new around here (and the hobby ?) so he probably wouldn't have know that "B" (LOL))

littleguy · Sep 11, 2003

Originally posted by VV
You're worth whatever YOU think your worth. Whether or not you get any clients at your price is a different story.

Ditto !!!

littleguy · Sep 11, 2003

Remember when pswope told you *I* would be around to "take that question" ???

Well, I won't bother going through the whole thing again (you're welcome everybody) but everything is relative Harlot. What is the alternative for many/most (if not all) of the ladies in question, including yourself ?

I mean, even if they made only $100 an hour (after taxes mind you (the equivalent of making a minimum of $150/hour at a "normal" job (approx $300,000/year for a 40 hr week) pre-tax - and yes, I realize it is presumptuous of me to assume the lady doesn't pay her taxes so if I insult any of them by saying that I apologize in advance), where else would they make that kind of money ???

danger-us · Sep 11, 2003

Keeping 150 per hour is not bad if you are getting say 5 clients per night (absolutely reasonable) . Plus tips on top of that. That's around 950-1050 a night right there. 4 nights a week equals 4 grand a week. That is not keeping so little for themselves. That's quite good money.

You don't choose this job if you can't handle all it's implications and compromises. If you can handle it, back up the truck and load on the cash, baby!

danger-us · Sep 11, 2003

Working girls, ex-working girls, phone ladies and ex-phone ladies often have axes to grind. Who can say for sure, but it is far from a remote possibility even if they seem to be on the level. That's the kind of business it is, just as you said.

The factual basis I have is from speeking with many girls at Julie's in the time since your "sources" laid that bull on you. And it doesn't jive. I've asked questions about BBFS and what kind of things Julie asks/demands of them. It may happen a girl here, a girl there (as happens everywhere) but from my information and my sources, I absolutely do not believe Julie is part of that. You don't think we'd all have heard a lot more about it if a madam was trying to convince girls to do BBFS? We'd have heard plenty out in the open, not just through your own personal channels.

You say you yourself have no ax to grind with Julie? You are trying to say that you didn't word your post to make Julie's seem as unattractive as possible? You don't think I know a thing or too about the use of language?

But even if your information was correct at the time, it is now clearly outdated. I've been to Julie's over the past 2 years (as well as many other UG posters) and the place is nothing like you described.

nabbeun · Sep 11, 2003

yucky

since that is the way you feel about the trade, it is probably best if you don't get into it. no matter how beautiful you are, that attitude would show through in your sessions, and no one would be satisfied. you know what they say, most important is to find work you enjoy, because you will be good at it, and the money will follow. nothing worse than dragging yourself to a job you hate or loathe every day.

without a doubt if you are beautiful you can get takers at 4-500. its a trade off, lower vol and higher price. to make the maximum dollars, i believe the sweet spot is in the $$ area, and that is why its where the market has generally settled. and less like at the spansh houses is considered dirt cheap but there is a limit in the girls capacity so even with unlimited customers avail they cannot reach peak earnings. and volume means a lot of hard work. at the other end, $400+ will mean many fewer clients, a lot less work. perhaps a couple a day? at $1k rates at an agency, a few a week? maximal dollars earned per unit of work, but not the most absolute dollars you could have earned. in the $$ range, expect 5-10 clients per day. it seems that most working girls like that balance; not too much physical work to do day in and out, but enough to stay busy so not bored. and the $ per add up quickly. where you want to fall in the amount of work/amount of return spectrum is entirely up to you.

some girls work for an agency just long enough to build up a clientele they want going forward. guys they are comfortable with and don't feel so much of that "yucky" factor. that they know more or less so the security and marketing aspect is not so daunting. then they go independent, keeps the house's share and give the guys a small break on the rate. this model works for a lot, but it take effort to setup. personally when i find a fav, i would love to cut out the middleman and see her outside for a somewhat reduced rate. it's also more personal. win-win for all but the previous agency. but they get their share of coin as the agent initially matching the buyers and sellers.

best of luck to you, in whatever your decide

pswope · Sep 11, 2003

d-u

you can infer anything you choose to.* However, without being privvy to these conversations and knowing my relationship wit the speakers, I think your characterization of the factual basis of my post re what happened at Julies is misguided.

As we both know cyber- t raverse hearings on prostitution factual disputes are an enormous waste of time.
Despite what you think,I couldn't give a rat's ass about Julies.(And I have noted and conceded that the info is old) I do care(perhaps pathectically so),when somone impugns my whoreboard cred.

*[size=1/64] employing your inferential logic, I can argue that currently employed working girls are not going to cop to the types of things mentioned for fear of losing their jobs[/size]

buddyyy · Sep 11, 2003

Re: yucky

What exactly is yucky about not wanting to service 5 - 10 clients a day?

Or for that matter any of the aversions that she expressed?

I would imagine that if she does things in a way that she feels comfortable that there might actually be times when she was with a client that she might not feel quite so strongly about wanting to be somewhere else. Something that I always have found to improve my experience.

danger-us · Sep 11, 2003

part 1.
Well, of course. Clearly you don't give a rat's ass, which made it easier for you to throw these things out there. To me, your post had more of a purpose than simply answering Harlot's questions. You worded your post to make it as unseemly as possible..

You were trying to represent what Julie's "is," You spoken of how the place "is" instead of how it "was" ( from your available sources.) I feel you misled (intentionally or not), making it appear that, at least your information was current. I don't think you should have been speaking about how Julie's "is." Julies is not the place you described.

part 2.
I am not impugning your credentials. I don't really know yours any better than you know mine. What I do know is that we've both participated in many conversations together. And that I've very much appreciated your perspectives. (And I hope our disagreement here doesn't affect our ability to share conversation on other matters). It just seems when it comes to Julie's, I've found some people have no problem stirring the pot. Your post seemed to fall in that catagory.

All these discussions start with someone making derogatory comments about Julie's with unknown motives. The motives are unknown for both sides because this board is anonymous. But they start with Julie bashing. Then comes the Julie defending. I'm sure that if anyone made that kind of allegation about April, several people ( probably including yourself) would line up to defend her. This board is better off when people don't start the trouble.

Did you really expect to say the things you did without being challenged by anyone? Because of your credentials? I think you're a valuable member of UG, yet this does not give you carte blanche.

danger-us · Sep 11, 2003

pwsope, my apologies if the tone seems too harsh.

pswope · Sep 11, 2003

d-u
Thank you for your post.
Fwiw, I regretted making the intial post 5 minutes after I posted it. It was a waste of bandwidth & ridiculously naive as well.

I agree that Julie's threads stir up more PMB tempests in teapots than virtually any other commercial sex topic and such emotions transcend the mere issues at hand in such threads. I concede that such collateral considerations may have colored the wording of my initial post.

I also believe that it is futile to argue about the place because many are pretty dug in wrt their respective perceptions of it.
For that reason,if I ever post about Julies again, I will let you force me to eat Patty in Macy's window. I'll take the A train there.

Julie's question

Harlot

Cloud Nine

I had to open my big mouth.......

Captain Kirk

*********

Thorn

Captain Kirk

Thorn

VV

Aerosol

pswope

One out of three

littleguy

Gold

littleguy

Gold

littleguy

Gold

danger-us

BACKCHANNEL BOY

danger-us

BACKCHANNEL BOY

nabbeun

pswope

One out of three

buddyyy

danger-us

BACKCHANNEL BOY

danger-us

BACKCHANNEL BOY

pswope

One out of three