Higher mileage during Lap dances

[Wwanderer]

Originally posted by justlooking
I agree with Wwanderer that in-club extras are only good in those clubs that have private rooms with beds or couches.

Are there (misnamed, imo) "strip clubs" in NYC where customers and dancers can retire to a private room with a bed (or couch usable as a bed), both disrobe and spend enough time in private to have something similar to a typical MP/agency/indie provider experience? If so, wow...I haven't been getting out enough. I have not seen any strip clubs like that in the US, ever. On the other hand, if I had, I wouldn't have called it a strip club.

-Ww

PS - Do the rooms have a shower too?

 

[justlooking]

Yes.

PS -- No.

 

[justlooking]

But they're not "misnamed" because (a) extras are not guaranteed and (b) they have stage shows. Out on the main floor, they look like all the other clubs. In fact, they are like all the other clubs. They just have particularly private and spacious VIP Rooms.

 

[Wwanderer]

Another question

Do the same places that have these well equipped private rooms also have dancers performing on a stage?

-Ww


Oops...crossed in the writing with your answer.

 

[justlooking]

Wwanderer, just so you understand, these aren't some secret special places I'm talking about. These are normal mainstream strip clubs that everybody in NYC's heard of.

 

[h. von bingen]

asscon sounds horrible. the places with back bedrooms sound horrible. suddenly, jl, i have far more compassion for your methodology.

 

[Wwanderer]

Originally posted by justlooking
Wwanderer, just so you understand, these aren't some secret special places I'm talking about. These are normal mainstream strip clubs that everybody in NYC's heard of.

Interesting. As far as I am aware this is a pretty unusual set-up re other places, particularly because of point a in your previous post ("extras are not guaranteed"). I can't think of a good analogy elsewhere. But if the extras are so unpredictable, why not just go to Julies or whatever?

-Ww

 

[Wwanderer]

I am going to let the Aussie lady I met in Tokyo in March know; she was planning to show up in NYC in May or June (see my post about the Roppongi dancer). I doubt she would be expecting this.

-Ww

 

[justlooking]

Originally posted by Wwanderer
I doubt she would be expecting this.

Now do you have a better feel for Danielle's dilemma?

N.B.: It isn't ALL the clubs that do this, and you wouldn't necessarily know which ones they are at the time you audition. Girls are absolutely not REQUIRED to put out in the Champagne Rooms. But OTOH, the ones who don't feel they have trouble competing with the ones who do. (In some of these clubs, the ones who do are a minority by a lot, BTW.)

 

[justlooking]

Originally posted by Wwanderer
But if the extras are so unpredictable, why not just go to Julies or whatever?

1. Because a lot of guys don't go to these clubs for extras.

2. Because if you're the kind of guy who does go for extras, they don't have to be that unpredictable (meaning that if you're knowledgeable enough to know they're available, you're probably also knowledgeable enough to be able to make sure you get them). (Although this should cast some light on a disagreement I had with slinkybender earlier in this thread which you might not have fully understood, about strippers' exploiting the "uncertainty" period during which a customer is figuring this out. Although in a way that's a false issue, because anyone well-connected enough to know that extras are available should be able to just ask management which girls do them.)

3. Because some guys -- like me -- actually like the uncertainty, and enjoy the sport of fishing for what we can get (even if that sometimes leaves you paying a relative lot for not very much).

 

[justlooking]

Originally posted by Wwanderer
Interesting. As far as I am aware this is a pretty unusual set-up re other places, particularly because of point a in your previous post ("extras are not guaranteed").

I would have thought this was common.

It certainly seemed to be the case at that club that was busted in Atlanta last year.

 

[Wwanderer]

Originally posted by justlooking
I would have thought this was common.

Well, I guess all the clubs on The Block in Baltimore could be considered similar, though their backrooms are not up to the standards you describe. It may just be that I am a bit out-of-date and that the scene has changed. I do not do much clubbing (in the US) anymore...for no particulart reason.

Anyway, fwiiw, the sorts of places that I have encountered fairly frequently include

1) What I would call a "real" strip club in the sense that the important business conducted there is exotic/erotic dancing, on-stage and in guys' laps. Sometimes there is a darker and more private VIP area and sometimes there is a private room. If so, what you can get in them varies; it might be just a more permissive dance, but it could also be a BJ or even FS. However, even in the latter case, the customer would probably remained clothed, and the whole business would be rushed (timed "by the song") and furitive, more like sex in your car with a streetwalker than like any other sort of provider experience. (Sometimes you can get an outside "date" with a dancer at one of these clubs. I have enjoyed the uncertainty of that sort of "sport fishing". But it is not something that she will be doing with more than a small minority of her customers, and she may well be keeping it secret from the club's management and the other dancers.)

2) What I would call a strip club style brothel where the main business is selling sex. Often there is very little dancing, sometimes none; if there is dancing, it is generally pretty listless and secondary...the girls just walking around on the stage leering at customers when it is their turn. The rest of the time they either spend trolling for or servicing customers. All, or very nearly all, of the "dancers" do BJs and/or FS as their main business, either in a private room or away from the club (you just pick them up there and pay the "bar fine", a la Thailand) or sometimes in a (usually dark) public area.

It sounds like NYC clubs are a sort of weird (imo) hybrid of these two common types.

Anyway, I do now better understand some of Danielle's issues, and SB's for that matter, and more about the whole debate. I must say that it sounds like a crappy system, one that makes for bad vibes and problems for customers and dancers alike. While I'd be interested to try one of these places (anything once), I doubt I would like them.

-Ww

 

[h. von bingen]

Originally posted by justlooking
enjoy the sport of fishing for what we can get

you see what i mean?

 

[justlooking]

Wwanderer

Just because I have this feeling I'm not being clear:

1. The clubs I'm talking about sound an awful lot like your No. 1. Any sex that may occur is still pretty furtive. (Although it's not timed "by the song". Most clubs in New York -- even the low-mileage ones -- time their VIP Room sessions by the hour.) It's just not as furtive as in the clubs where the Champagne Room consists of either semi-public cubicles or tiny individual rooms with a couple of chairs. For the most part,* outside "dating" at these clubs is just as you describe it. I'll repeat that I'd be surprised if there weren't many clubs in many cities with management-sanctioned in-club sex such as I'm describing.

2. These clubs aren't a "New York" norm. They don't constitute a majority of the clubs here. But they exist. And my main point is, they're not thought of any differently from the other clubs. They look just like them. They operate just like them in almost all respects. They just have more private VIP Rooms, which sometimes can be taken advantage of. Another salient point, though, is that most customers probably have no idea what's available in these clubs. Only the real "players" do. (Or customers who luck into extras.)
____________________________________________
* I say "for the most part" because things I've seen indicate that there are very few clubs that won't cooperate in arranging compensated out-of-club "dates" with strippers for very big-spending regular customers. That, of course, is completely different from the kind of sub rosa "dating" you and I do.

 

[justlooking]

Originally posted by h. von bingen
you see what i mean?

No, I don't.

You seem to think that I'm somehow influencing women to do something they'd never do. I'd say I'm ferreting out women who'll do what I'm interested in. Even if, for whatever reason, they decide they'll do more with me than with most others.

To me, when you talk like that, you sound like all the morons in that Stripper Web thread who made as if that guy forced that $30,000 on the poor stripper.

 

[justlooking]

More to Wwanderer

But, having said what I've said, I should make clear that:

1. In New York, as I believe in most places, furtive in-club sex (of one kind or another) is available in most clubs from some strippers.

2. In New York, as I believe in most places, out-of-club "dating" is avaiable in all clubs, either from "daters" who are essentially "prostitutes fronting as dancers" (to borrow an old thread title) or from strippers who do it occassionally with selected customers in the manner you described above.

 

[shorty]

WOW- a topic that really peaked my interest. Where do I start?

I'll start with this. I've been a very avid club go-er for the past 20 years. I've said it before, if there is a dive bar with a brass pole and girl dancing, I've been there.

In the 20 years that I've been doing this, the atmosphere definitely has changed. And not just in New York but all over. And oddly enough, so have my expectations. It used to be that when I go to a club, I have a beer or two, hand over dollar bills and be on my way. The most mileage expected was brushing up against her tit as you put the dollar in her bra. LD's were non-existant in most clubs and if they did, it was a champagne room at astronomical amounts.

Now, I've come to expect $20 LD. With the exception of one or two favorite haunts of mine where I go to just have a beer, if a club doesn't do some form of LDs, I don't bother. These are the clubs that suffer. ie - Slappy's in Paterson. The place is empty now because the mileage is almost nill when it used to be guaranteed for extras.

The ones with the higher mileage LD's get more of my business. Why? Because that's become the norm and my mentality for why I go has changed. I've come to expect some gropin during an LD. I think that most clubs know that guys aren't there just to watch a girl shake her ass in a bikini. They always want more, and the ones that get the return business are the ones that management 'tolerates' or condones higher mileage dances.

The level of mileage that you can get, to a certain degree, is also based on a couple prime factors:

1. Location and municipal laws - we can thank Guiliani for the downturn in mileage in NYC mainstream clubs. On a trip to Indianapolis last year, I visited 5 different clubs in 3 nights. Out of the 5, mileage was extremely high in 4 of them. DFK and HJ readily available without a hassle and more if you take a private LD. Obviously the laws are not as strict and the girls don't think twice about it. I also took one of them back to my hotel room for the night. Cost ? $$ for the whole night (plus dinner - roomservice). But when I went to Atlanta, the 4-5 clubs I went to were horrible. The girls were total teases and promised 'a good time' in the private room and all I got was a "no, I don't do that", "no, you can't do this" and even after I offered more when I was out 150 each time. And this was in clubs where the girls were seriously hungry for money and wasn't mainstream. That's the norm for Atlanta.

2. How busy is the club? (if there are 2 girls and 20 guys, you're not getting diddly that night). Also the more mainstream and popular a club is, the less likely your mileage will be high. And if you do get high mileage it will be at a substantial cost. ie. - scores, flashdancers, satin dolls, .....

3. Your interaction with the girls. Ya gotta be a gentleman about it. It takes time to develop a repor with the girls. Some of the best LD's I have ever gotten were from girls that I just sat and bought them a drink and talked to them like a human being and not a piece of meat. There was a girl that I knew at WildThings in Elizabeth that was cold as fish with my buddies in during LD's when we went. But she'd give me some of the best grindage, open HJ, DFK LD's that I've gotten from anyone. Why? Because I talked to her about her school, her kids, and not about how horney I was or how badly I wanted to bang her.

I could go on about this for pages on end. but I'll stop here and make one last point. I have to agree with JL in that it's not so much about the extras but more about the hunt of the possibilities of getting extras. If I really needed to get laid or a bj and pay $$$, I'll call a provider and not have to worry about the hassle. It's more about the excitement of finding out HOW FAR WILL SHE GO?

 

[pjorourke]

Originally posted by Wwanderer
Anyway, I do now better understand some of Danielle's issues, and SB's for that matter...

Slinky has issues?

 

[h. von bingen]

shorty, except for the unfortunate misspelling of the word rapport -- very informative. by all means post more.

jl, it was the analogy to sport fishing that got my hackles up. but, oth, if you will cop to ferreting what can i say?

 

[pjorourke]

Originally posted by h. von bingen
jl, it was the analogy to sport fishing that got my hackles up. but, oth, if you will cop to ferreting what can i say?

I thought "sport fishing" was a great analogy. Both sports are very expensive. They are largely "guy things". In sport fishing one usually releases the quarry after landing them. Also, if you choose to keep the quarry, it is very expensive (mounting costs, transportation, etc.). Hemmingway would approve.