On the subject of condiments...
- Thread starter Thorn
- Start date
Can true companionship [re:affection] be purchased?
I saw this addressed only to providers on another board and realized it is the essence of this discussion. So I add it to this thread addressed to all:
Can affection be purchased? I would think the answer is obviously no, but perhaps other disagree.
If I am right about it though, and I admit I could be wrong, but if I am right why does it seem that there is a contingent among clients trying to do precisely that?
Isn't that heart of the issue when we are talking about "condiments".
That this "hobby" should be about adding to sexuality in our lives but not attempting to replace genuine affection that can't be purchased by only grow from time and exposure to other people who we come to enjoy?
I am not saying affection doesn't happen between providers and clients. I am saying when it happens it has nothing to do with the exchange of money. It happens, not because of the client/provider relationship but outside of it, maybe even despite it [because I would state that the requirements of many providers to guard themselves [psyche] to some degree would prohibit the ability for them to become truly affectionate with clients.
Some people find this topic uncomfortable, but I would hope we can have an adult discussion about it as it is germane to "this thing of ours", and if we can't discuss it here, on a PMB, where can you talk about it?
What do you folks think about it?
Is it healthy for a client to want genuine affection from a provider as a stranger just walking in for the first time?
Is it healthy for a provider to be open enough to give that sort of affection, or is she risking too much?
How much are clients who seek this sort of "service" responsible for some of the things we see like stalking, outings, etc that sometime come out of this when it goes wrong?
The floor is open...
I saw this addressed only to providers on another board and realized it is the essence of this discussion. So I add it to this thread addressed to all:
Can affection be purchased? I would think the answer is obviously no, but perhaps other disagree.
If I am right about it though, and I admit I could be wrong, but if I am right why does it seem that there is a contingent among clients trying to do precisely that?
Isn't that heart of the issue when we are talking about "condiments".
That this "hobby" should be about adding to sexuality in our lives but not attempting to replace genuine affection that can't be purchased by only grow from time and exposure to other people who we come to enjoy?
I am not saying affection doesn't happen between providers and clients. I am saying when it happens it has nothing to do with the exchange of money. It happens, not because of the client/provider relationship but outside of it, maybe even despite it [because I would state that the requirements of many providers to guard themselves [psyche] to some degree would prohibit the ability for them to become truly affectionate with clients.
Some people find this topic uncomfortable, but I would hope we can have an adult discussion about it as it is germane to "this thing of ours", and if we can't discuss it here, on a PMB, where can you talk about it?
What do you folks think about it?
Is it healthy for a client to want genuine affection from a provider as a stranger just walking in for the first time?
Is it healthy for a provider to be open enough to give that sort of affection, or is she risking too much?
How much are clients who seek this sort of "service" responsible for some of the things we see like stalking, outings, etc that sometime come out of this when it goes wrong?
The floor is open...
The old chicken and egg question.
I have seen some people on the board make delusion claims which they cannot back up, and get hide in the closet when corned.
There is one guy who has taken on the persona of James Bond.
The last two paragraphs are a joke so don't rip my head off.
To answer your question: Depends, you have to always remain level headed, and keep it all in prospective. Understand we do what we do which is different for all of us.
I th
I have seen some people on the board make delusion claims which they cannot back up, and get hide in the closet when corned.
There is one guy who has taken on the persona of James Bond.
The last two paragraphs are a joke so don't rip my head off.
To answer your question: Depends, you have to always remain level headed, and keep it all in prospective. Understand we do what we do which is different for all of us.
I th
It is like anything else
Anything done in moderation is OK. I like my Big Mac Fries, or White Castle Murder Burgers, but not every day. Twice a month I indulge in fast/junk food. The rest of time I eat a healthy diet. I know people who eat fast food 7 days a week. I would not dare tell them that is why they are over weight, or are sick every month.
Not Pointing Fingers The danger in hobbying is when you go over the top. Examples - You fall in love with a provider, you believe that you can change her. Start painting a picture in your mind of having a long term one to one relationship with her - making plans in your head of marriage, children. I have read many guys who fell in deep love with a provider, to each there own, but that can not be healthy.
It is also easy to go over the top with our morals, crossing the line into homo-sexuality. If that has been your thing, G@d bless you, but to suddenly start seeing TV's, getting sensual messages from men, I believe that is also not healthy.
You can also start over top with SW's, who are for the most part are not clean and drug addicts. I know guys who pick them up daily, make out, go down on them, bbs, take them to hotel rooms and even back to there house. This behavior will only lead to illness. To take it one step further, many guys themselves started doing drugs with the girls, who never did it before. Hanging out with SW's on a steady basis will only lead to no good.
Then of course, how Kinky do you want to go? Having fists in your butt? Bondage? Getting pissed or shitted on? All very unhealthy behavior IMHO.
Anything done in moderation is OK. I like my Big Mac Fries, or White Castle Murder Burgers, but not every day. Twice a month I indulge in fast/junk food. The rest of time I eat a healthy diet. I know people who eat fast food 7 days a week. I would not dare tell them that is why they are over weight, or are sick every month.
Not Pointing Fingers The danger in hobbying is when you go over the top. Examples - You fall in love with a provider, you believe that you can change her. Start painting a picture in your mind of having a long term one to one relationship with her - making plans in your head of marriage, children. I have read many guys who fell in deep love with a provider, to each there own, but that can not be healthy.
It is also easy to go over the top with our morals, crossing the line into homo-sexuality. If that has been your thing, G@d bless you, but to suddenly start seeing TV's, getting sensual messages from men, I believe that is also not healthy.
You can also start over top with SW's, who are for the most part are not clean and drug addicts. I know guys who pick them up daily, make out, go down on them, bbs, take them to hotel rooms and even back to there house. This behavior will only lead to illness. To take it one step further, many guys themselves started doing drugs with the girls, who never did it before. Hanging out with SW's on a steady basis will only lead to no good.
Then of course, how Kinky do you want to go? Having fists in your butt? Bondage? Getting pissed or shitted on? All very unhealthy behavior IMHO.
In my mind there are at least three types of johns whose behavior might be outwardly similar:
1. Johns who are trying to purchase genuine affection
2. Johns who are trying to purchase an act that mimics genuine affection
3. Johns who want to visit prostitutes that are open to the idea of being affectionate in the right circumstances.
For most of the time I paid for sex, I thought of myself in the second category. By the end I felt I was squarely in the third. I'm not sure if or when there was a change.
But I think the answer to your question differs depending on what kind of specific behavior you're discussing.
1. Johns who are trying to purchase genuine affection
2. Johns who are trying to purchase an act that mimics genuine affection
3. Johns who want to visit prostitutes that are open to the idea of being affectionate in the right circumstances.
For most of the time I paid for sex, I thought of myself in the second category. By the end I felt I was squarely in the third. I'm not sure if or when there was a change.
But I think the answer to your question differs depending on what kind of specific behavior you're discussing.
(Emphasis added)
This is why you aren't just purchasing sex. I think you're also using money as a social cue for anyone who might have fucked you for free or who might prefer a different arrangement with you.
I mean, despite my desire to pay women who were willing to be affectionate, I also wanted, and occasionally used, the ability to guiltlessly detach myself completely and instantly from someone who might have affection for me. Whether or not the transfer of money really ought to have lifted my sense of guilt is probably a relevant theme for this thread.
And of course you don't purchase affection. You can't purchase affection.
This is why you aren't just purchasing sex. I think you're also using money as a social cue for anyone who might have fucked you for free or who might prefer a different arrangement with you.
I mean, despite my desire to pay women who were willing to be affectionate, I also wanted, and occasionally used, the ability to guiltlessly detach myself completely and instantly from someone who might have affection for me. Whether or not the transfer of money really ought to have lifted my sense of guilt is probably a relevant theme for this thread.
And of course you don't purchase affection. You can't purchase affection.
Last edited:
Affection happens also to unsuspected johns who may have not been necessarily looking for it. Or who were not consciously looking for it.
I never thought myself as pertaining to any of these three categories (great job by justme lining them up). Mine has always been the torturing curiosity of watching and touching naked strange women. Affection has happened almost anytime.
A john who transmits trust, who notices what bothers or scares the provider, who is relatively generous is always bound to win affection.
Of course, affection has levels of depth. Maybe we should start by establishing what kind of affection we should discuss about.
I never thought myself as pertaining to any of these three categories (great job by justme lining them up). Mine has always been the torturing curiosity of watching and touching naked strange women. Affection has happened almost anytime.
A john who transmits trust, who notices what bothers or scares the provider, who is relatively generous is always bound to win affection.
Of course, affection has levels of depth. Maybe we should start by establishing what kind of affection we should discuss about.
Affection can be purchased... indirectly
Of course, not in a direct way. As he himself said it, the obvious answer to Thorn’s question is No.
However, while I cannot buy affection, I can buy time. By offering money to a provider, I can buy not only sex with her, but idle time too, during which I can explore opportunities to know her better and to give her the chance to know me better. Repeated sessions have the potential to create familiarity, to lower the emotional barriers and so on.
I wonder if you guys have seen that movie, As Good As It Gets, with Jack Nicholson. (Famous quote: "Carol the waiter, Simon the fag.") He did not purchase her affection, but he did finance the health care for her sick kid, which opened him the way to ask for more time with her, eventually leading to supposedly genuine affection.
Often all you need is time and a good disposition.
Of course, not in a direct way. As he himself said it, the obvious answer to Thorn’s question is No.
However, while I cannot buy affection, I can buy time. By offering money to a provider, I can buy not only sex with her, but idle time too, during which I can explore opportunities to know her better and to give her the chance to know me better. Repeated sessions have the potential to create familiarity, to lower the emotional barriers and so on.
I wonder if you guys have seen that movie, As Good As It Gets, with Jack Nicholson. (Famous quote: "Carol the waiter, Simon the fag.") He did not purchase her affection, but he did finance the health care for her sick kid, which opened him the way to ask for more time with her, eventually leading to supposedly genuine affection.
Often all you need is time and a good disposition.
Thanks for this opportunity Thorn.
I think that the clients who go in expecting to buy affection, mostly belonging to Justme's First Category, are often relative easily and early dispensed with. They can become stalkers, they can become dangerous and they can hurt themselves and the providers they get obsessed with. However, chances are that everything is solved relatively soon.
I believe that the potential great dramas, tragedies or even comedies if you wish, happen to unsuspected mongers and providers and those from Justme's Third Category (please note that the Unsuspected Category and JTC are not mutually exclusive).
The affection here is more likely to appear and grow naturally, comfortably and with deeper roots. This is the case when it can be taken to the "next level".
I think that the clients who go in expecting to buy affection, mostly belonging to Justme's First Category, are often relative easily and early dispensed with. They can become stalkers, they can become dangerous and they can hurt themselves and the providers they get obsessed with. However, chances are that everything is solved relatively soon.
I believe that the potential great dramas, tragedies or even comedies if you wish, happen to unsuspected mongers and providers and those from Justme's Third Category (please note that the Unsuspected Category and JTC are not mutually exclusive).
The affection here is more likely to appear and grow naturally, comfortably and with deeper roots. This is the case when it can be taken to the "next level".
that doesn't sound delusional at all. (in fact, your delusion-free, honest posts are one of the reasons i've been missing ug.) (the other reason, of course, is thorn.)
i mean, isn't affection an innocuous thing, even mundane in a happy kind of a way? me, i feel affectionate towards most of my clients. (and if i don't, i don't see them again.) over the years, this has been a constant - except during periods when i was seeing a lot of people. that's the thing that kills my ability to feel affection; volume. i think every girl has her own personal threshold for volume tolerance, and when i start feeling numb and detached, i know i have exceeded mine.
in my experience, affection (as opposed to neediness or obsession) is generally healthy in hobby relationships. now that i think about it, i'd hate the business if affection was not a part of it.
i mean, isn't affection an innocuous thing, even mundane in a happy kind of a way? me, i feel affectionate towards most of my clients. (and if i don't, i don't see them again.) over the years, this has been a constant - except during periods when i was seeing a lot of people. that's the thing that kills my ability to feel affection; volume. i think every girl has her own personal threshold for volume tolerance, and when i start feeling numb and detached, i know i have exceeded mine.
in my experience, affection (as opposed to neediness or obsession) is generally healthy in hobby relationships. now that i think about it, i'd hate the business if affection was not a part of it.
Last edited:
Not surprising I find that while I originally thought of seeing dancers for other reaons it has become much more about someone who, by the time we are having sex, already knows me and has indicated she acknowledges chemistry exists and there is some level of pre-existing affection. [is that peels of laughter I hear?]