The Borgias

#1
Just learned that those bastards over at Showtime just cancelled one of my favorite shows, right at what would of been the best part where Cesare starts taking over parts of Italy. Well, if anyone else was a fan of the show and would like to know the history of this family and how things turn out I suggest reading The Borgias The Hidden History by G.J Meyers. I finished it a month ago and it's excellent.
 
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#3
They canceled it because it's not nearly as good nor gets remotely close to the ratings that Boardwalk Empire or Game of Thrones gets.
 
#4
The main reason The Borgias failed because they surrounded one of the greatest actors of modern history with a bunch of amateurs. The other actors seemed like they were performing in Summer Stock next to the great Jeremy Irons. Jeremy son Max is excellent in The White Queen, he inherited his father's acting skills and good looks and unlike The Borgias The White Queen has two very accomplished actors as main characters to help carry the story, Janet Mcteer and James Frain.
 
#5
They canceled it because it's not nearly as good nor gets remotely close to the ratings that Boardwalk Empire or Game of Thrones gets.
Both of those shows have strong supporting casts and charaters you are emotionally invested in. Boardwalk Empire is probably the most expensive show to produce, the attention to detail of that time period is incredible, nothing about it feels modern. I don't want to spoil anything for those who haven't seen the show but that one GOT episode this season (if you watch you know the one) was so shocking there was no exit music. I guess that what it takes to keep up with demand.
 
#9
The main reason The Borgias failed because they surrounded one of the greatest actors of modern history with a bunch of amateurs. The other actors seemed like they were performing in Summer Stock next to the great Jeremy Irons. Jeremy son Max is excellent in The White Queen, he inherited his father's acting skills and good looks and unlike The Borgias The White Queen has two very accomplished actors as main characters to help carry the story, Janet Mcteer and James Frain.
You make a good point, I didn't like the actress who played Lucrezia at all. I'm downloading this White Queen now to check it out. I'm able to get all 10 episodes since it has already been aired on the BBC. A while back you talked about Banshee so I checked that out also and although it's a little far fetched I enjoyed it. Have you been watching Ray Donovan?
 
#10
Both of those shows have strong supporting casts and charaters you are emotionally invested in. Boardwalk Empire is probably the most expensive show to produce, the attention to detail of that time period is incredible, nothing about it feels modern. I don't want to spoil anything for those who haven't seen the show but that one GOT episode this season (if you watch you know the one) was so shocking there was no exit music. I guess that what it takes to keep up with demand.
I stared at the screen for 10 minutes in shock disbelief. I just spent the last 2 months reading the books and now that I'm finished I'm sort of depressed because they are so good and now I have to wait a year or so for book 6 The Winds of Winter to come out. The show is great, the books are better. READ THE BOOKS.
 
#11
You make a good point, I didn't like the actress who played Lucrezia at all. I'm downloading this White Queen now to check it out. I'm able to get all 10 episodes since it has already been aired on the BBC. A while back you talked about Banshee so I checked that out also and although it's a little far fetched I enjoyed it. Have you been watching Ray Donovan?
Banchee is in a graphic novel format, it's designed to be far fetched. It could have gone wrong in so many ways, the premise is unbelievable but is saved with great writing and excellent casting, it's dificult to pull off pulp fiction without it being super depressing or corny. All the charaters are necessary and interesting. On paper a plot that includes Amish Mafia kingpin who like his women to wear bonnets while servicing him, Native American and Russian mafia, a cross dressing computer expert combat fighter, a anti hero ex con combat fighter imposter, a former prize fighter, a Russian Mafia princess in exile all inhabiting a small NE town seems ludicrous but it works.

I gave up on Ray Donovan, it reminds me of Brotherhood which I didn't like either. I could not get past the wife, she's accepts the obviously insane dad but has a problem with the man who is providing for her family. I couldn't believe her lack of trust in Ray's judgement, he might be walking the line with legality and fidelity but after almost two decades of marriage she doubts his very serious warnings about his father, I stopped watching it after that.

The White Queen is what The Tudors tried to be, it's stylish and sexy without being pornographic. Historically Elizabeth had 10 children so of course there is lots of sex but it leans towards the romantic and she's stunningly beautiful plus clever, you can see why he is so in love with her. I'm wouldn't be surprised if Janet Mcteer gets nominated for something, she steals every scene.
 
#12
I stared at the screen for 10 minutes in shock disbelief. I just spent the last 2 months reading the books and now that I'm finished I'm sort of depressed because they are so good and now I have to wait a year or so for book 6 The Winds of Winter to come out. The show is great, the books are better. READ THE BOOKS.
I did the same, I just stared at the TV thinking did that just really happen, I was completely taken by surprise.
 
#14
Emily you should go back and give Ray Donovan another try Jon Voitght is a great actor. Of course Breaking bad is the best show on TV right now.
On your recommendation I gave Ray Donovan another try and I just can't convince myself to like it. The wife irrates me, the father is revolting and the accents seem forced and too out of place for the environment. The Boston accent is one of those distinctive American accents that needs to be toned down and normally most actors even seasoned good actors tend to exaggerate it, I find it distracts from the storyline. I have seen Liev do a perfect Queen's English and Russian but he struggles with the Boston one, they all do, it is possibly the hardest accent to successfully pull off without seeming forced. It would have been so much easier for the whole cast if the Donovan family came from a random industrial American city and just were allowed to speak naturally. It's not easy to have a successful show, why add more to the plate with a difficult accent? It's just bad story development and Showtime should have learned their lesson after the failure of Brotherhood. I predict the show will not last more then two seasons.

I agree Breaking Bad is one of the best shows on right now, there will be acknowledgement this coming Award season. The writing and acting is as good as it gets, it's has raised the bar.
 
#15
I gave up on Ray Donovan, it reminds me of Brotherhood which I didn't like either. I could not get past the wife, she's accepts the obviously insane dad but has a problem with the man who is providing for her family. I couldn't believe her lack of trust in Ray's judgement, he might be walking the line with legality and fidelity but after almost two decades of marriage she doubts his very serious warnings about his father, I stopped watching it after that.
I found that peculiar about the wife also but Sunday's episode explained it. It was the best episode so far, I loved John Voight's dialogue with Rosanna Arquette and the music at the end was great.

Breaking Bad the ending was ridiculous. 6 or 7 guys with assault rifles firing about 1000 rounds at 2 guys standing in the open 30 yards away and they didn't even get a scratch.

The White Queen is good. I can't stand that Lady Margaret. The actor who plays Edwards brother George also played Juan Borgia. I guess he is typecast as a scumbag.

In Boardwalk Empire what the hell is half face up to?

Between Dexter and GOT I've seen enough throats sliced open.
 
#16
I found that peculiar about the wife also but Sunday's episode explained it. It was the best episode so far, I loved John Voight's dialogue with Rosanna Arquette and the music at the end was great.

Breaking Bad the ending was ridiculous. 6 or 7 guys with assault rifles firing about 1000 rounds at 2 guys standing in the open 30 yards away and they didn't even get a scratch.

The White Queen is good. I can't stand that Lady Margaret. The actor who plays Edwards brother George also played Juan Borgia. I guess he is typecast as a scumbag.

In Boardwalk Empire what the hell is half face up to?

Between Dexter and GOT I've seen enough throats sliced open.
We don't know who got shot in Breaking Bad, it's a cliffhanger, there is always twists and turns which is what makes it exciting. The menacing direction is similar to the Sopranos, violence is around every corner even during quiet moments.

I think Lady Margret is portrayed authentically, pious, overbearing, devoted and relentless. I imagined her looking sickly from self torture, she looks like a woman who spends days praying without food and water. She was hardcore even in those times, raised the first Tudor King, married three times and founded two universities in Cambridge that still stand. She was grandmother of Henry VIII and Great Grandmother to Elizabeth I. I imagine some of the royals went a little mad living in such an unstable environment, one day you are living large as a member of the royal court the next day your head could be on a block of wood waiting for the ax to drop, your whole existence depended on who wins the next battle.

Boardwalk Empire would be nothing without the faceless guy, he is intriguing. There is lots of violence in that show as well, everything has gore now, throat slashing and face shooting is standard practice.

I can't be bothered waiting for Ray Donovan wife's explanation, I really have no interest or emotional investment in the characters, I must prefer Copper.

Back to the Borgias, Jeremy Irons is known to demand top dollar, he's got a castle somewhere to keep up. He is gifted but is in it mostly for the money, I guess they couldn't afford a proper cast with Irons salary demands. It's a shame considering he started his glorious career in television, a star making performance in Brideshead Revisted and was brilliant in his second television venture Longitude. It's a shame he's made very bad choices driven by greed in the past decade, he still shines but just not as bright anymore.
 
#17
That guy who plays George and Juan probably befriended the powerful Irons family and got a role in The White Queen, that how show buisness works. After a while you notice who shares screen time with who and know its such a selective inner circle if your lucky enough to get in, it is who you know.
 
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