Millennial American born providers problematic?

[popeye]

Is it just me or are others finding Millennial American born providers problematic? Of late I was tempted by photos of amazing looking young women from escort ads online. My natural preference is mature and foreign born Asian providers. But the body on some of these young ones, of all ethnicity, is to die for.

Yet every time I call one up I hear the same tone in the voice. An air of indifference, impatience and just general lack of customer service in attitude. Not to mention the lack of respect for people's time; which ironically is what they always say about the Johns.

At first I thought it was an ethnic thing, because I typically encountered attitude issues with the majority of ethnic/ urban providers. Lately I have noticed such ill temperament with under 30 providers of all ethnicity, and it gets worse the closer they are to their early 20s. When dealing with under 30 women in the sex trade I only seem to get decent service from foreign born providers. Their American born sisters all seem out for the hustle.

This also goes across price range. Recently I discovered a high end white girl trolling CL when she needs the extra income, for a discount from her high end escort rates. At first she is very nice when making contact. But when it comes to closing the deal it is all about what you cannot do for the sum she requires, which by CL standards is on the high side. Supposedly, when you get her through the high end agency it is all GFE. Perhaps she has to troll on CL because her attitude isn't winning her too many repeat Johns in the high end world. By the way the girl I mention is under between 20-25 and has an amazing rear end.

Thank you to online escorting websites for spoiling these girls. Traditionally they would have had to go the route of the cat-house, or have someone teach them the ropes prior to being an independent. Now all they need is a post on Craigslist or Backpage and they are up and running selling their asses to the highest bidder. While providing shitty service to all the suckers that do not know better. I am just peeved at the sad state of mongering these days. The idea of building a steady clientele without bilking the customer is a lost concept to these women. Someone should tell them no clients, no money. Take a little at a time, make him keep wanting to come back and you will make out better in the long run.

Regards,

Pops

 

[scoochamenz1]

i'm so old now, the only girls under 30 i want near me are my nieces, lol. i've been doing this to long to put up with bullshit from young girls and i'm more interested in performance over looks.i understand young girls don't want old, fat guys, but what the fuck, you're a whore and the fact is, we're gonna be a lot of your clientele. if you don't like sucking midddle aged and old guy cock, go work at mcdonalds.

 

[fairemily]

Pops, it's a double edged sword, if it wasn't for the business getting off the limited printed page and going online you wouldn't have this place to find reviews and vent frustrations. If you think these girls are spoiled by their choices think of how much the your end doesn't have to answer some ad in NYM or Screw and walk in blind anymore. The options you want are dwindling because the tech options to make money on youth and beauty alone has expanded like web video cam. I also thought the whole youth and beauty advantage is you don't have to compensate with service or personality, I think that's always the standard view. Any person raised never knowing what it was like before the internet is going to naturally have less interactive social skills then the generations before, the human empathy disconnect is just going to get worse, we adapt or become obsolete.

 

[popeye]

Thank you both for sharing your thoughts in response to my comments. I laughed at the first comment, and Emily's as usual left me with food for thought. Yes, the virtual red light district has its advantages, and as pointed out the ability to safely view variety from the comfort and safety of ones home. I still remember Times Square when it was a red light district. It was veritable cornucopia of people flesh peddling at every door entry. Not to mention the smell of cannabis wafting through the air along with cheap perfume, garbage and fast food.

In those days the competition was fierce and the women truly had to learn how to entice customers. A very cut throat environment fueled by drugs, organized crime and corrupt vice officers. It truly was a dangerous environment. Yes the online red light district has its advantages for all as it has sanitized a very murky world..

Yet, at the core of sex trade is the ability to engage in illicit sex acts with a willing stranger for a fee, its still two human beings getting it on. The human element can never be lost otherwise one should stay home and rub it out. Based on current trend with young providers and their tendency for uninspired service could future generations be able to subsist on more vapid commercial sexual encounters than is the case today?

If so, then I can truly see where folks would prefer an orgazmitron device to a live human. What a sad state of affairs is ahead of us. I guess I’ll retire to some primitive place where they still know how to get it on old school style- with passion and zest.

Regards,

Pops

 

[fairemily]

Pops, you mentioned Times Square, that is the other thing, women used to work together because they had no feasibile way to be indendent and a natural competition occurred. the saw the direct financial results of the ladies who went above and beyond who were equal in looks and it made an impact. If you are on your own with no set of standards you have to meet or compare then add in the occasional contempt it will be uninspired.

 

[puffin]

Best sex partner I ever had was 24 and quite the hipster with a little bone through her nose and only slight trimming. She was sexy in an earthy womanly way, strong willed yet never gratuitously snarky.

I think the young girls today are more inclined to see sex as simply a biologically motivated act devoid of political statement, which was not the case twenty or more years ago. I am constantly on the lookout for the rare provider who wants some extra cash, but is not compelled to put herself out there to such an extent that she is looking to get things over with. That is to say, going through as many clients as possible before she pays her bills (or visits her supplier).

Such women are rare yes, and perhaps I would give up the search, were it not for three really seriously sexy women I met who were fun all night. Crazy as it sounds, finding that combination is not very different than dating. In fact I came across something a few days ago, but though she called herself curvy, the curve it was all sphere and no waist. In fact she already has medical problems and was texting me with updates. I was ready to take her home the night we met, but she deferred, when she texted me later with an offer, I was sober, so I nixed that.

Yes, she was a fun girl, but the idea of paying for it. Nah, I'll pass.

 

[fairemily]

I think what our media and entertainment influences reflect on what we find sexy in our early 20's. A generation ago older men even those who let themselves go a bit like Jack Nicholson were still cast as leading men, today if you are over 50 and don't resemble George Clooney you don't the girl unless you have wealth or some special skill. We are influenced what is attractive and sexy by what is immediate to us during formible years. It's also our exposure to men 20 years older, a generation ago the 20 year older experiments were by baby boomers who are probably the least sexually isolated interactive generation of modern times.

 

[popeye]

Interesting comments all around. True- there is nothing like young flesh that knows what their doing. In the past it was an issue of nerves and lack of experience that made me give up on young pros; never a lack of willingness. Now, with the new crop its purely attitude. Fortunate is the guy who finds the ideal combination of youth, experience and willingness to provide a good time. Like one of the guys said finding such talent is like dating; I do not engage in commercial sex because I am looking for a date. I am here for the expedience of getting my jollies off and willing to compensate accordingly.

Yes, it would appear lack of close proximity and seeing how the competition performs is a key missing ingredient. From questions I've been asked by some of these younger independents it is evident they truly have no clue about the competition. Nor of some basic public health regimens that can save them from catching the most basic infections. I do not mean STD related, but stuff like yeast infection and other bugger's that come from unsanitary conditions. Which often appear as UTI in guys.

I guess for every advancement in tech we seem to become less advanced in some of the basic stuff that has helped us become modern.

Regards,

Pops

 

[fairemily]

Interesting comments all around. True- there is nothing like young flesh that knows what their doing. In the past it was an issue of nerves and lack of experience that made me give up on young pros; never a lack of willingness. Now, with the new crop its purely attitude. Fortunate is the guy who finds the ideal combination of youth, experience and willingness to provide a good time. Like one of the guys said finding such talent is like dating; I do not engage in commercial sex because I am looking for a date. I am here for the expedience of getting my jollies off and willing to compensate accordingly.

Yes, it would appear lack of close proximity and seeing how the competition performs is a key missing ingredient. From questions I've been asked by some of these younger independents it is evident they truly have no clue about the competition. Nor of some basic public health regimens that can save them from catching the most basic infections. I do not mean STD related, but stuff like yeast infection and other bugger's that come from unsanitary conditions. Which often appear as UTI in guys.

I guess for every advancement in tech we seem to become less advanced in some of the basic stuff that has helped us become modern.

Regards,

Pops

Pops, I spoke with a guy who used me as a reference to see a younger provider and she said to him why would I need to speak to her. I give references partly because its the right thing to do but the other to connect with providers I don't know, it's never a bad think to expand your circle of friends in this buisness. Most do not want any communication with other providers, maybe it's denial or arrogance or both. I think the isolation is a big part of the disconnect, they have no standard to work from. It's probably a not one factor but a combination of many but on the flip side older providers are benefiting because millennial guys desire the attention and human connection they are lacking from their peers.

 

[popeye]

What you say about younger mongers prefering older/mature providers is so true. When I used to see more non Asian providers, especially the Eastern Europeans- who tended to well advanced in age, a few of them would tell me how young their clients were. To my surprise they the mature providers relished the energy and stamina of younger men. As long as it didn't wear them out for the day. Anyway, the ladies that shared such info with me dismissed the interest by of young regulars to a mother/matron fetish. However based on our discussion here I am of the mind the options for quality service without the hustle is as limited for the young guys as they are for me. Great observation E.

Regards,

Pops

 

[fairemily]

Pops, you also mention about these young providers not understanding basic protection from common transmitable things like candida, bacteria or UTI. It was an older man who told me what to look out for in my early days of sexual activity, I think that practice of teaching doesn't exist anymore due to our growing indifference and irrational shame. All woman who are sexually active should have Cystex and Balneol, handy, they are essentials in preventive care. As a caring confident older man you can pass that info along to underinformed younger ladies you encounter. There should be a handbook for these kind of issues.

 

[popeye]

Wow- interesting revelation. However, I very much doubt he was a client. Then again who knows, anything is possible. Broaching the subject of personal hygiene with an anonymous sexual encounter is not an easy matter. It is usually what happens between lovers, or people who see each other sexually on a regular basis. Yet, I do agree with you, when and if I do establish something of a regular thing with one of these younger women, if I find the holy grail of a mistress among them, i'll make it my personal responsibility to mentor her as best as I can.

On that note, this exchange made me reflect on my past encounters with young-un providers, and in a few cases did find myself in the role of older councilor. Unfortunately, some of the drama these girls get themselves into made them too much a liability. I remember one lady I wanted to assist in getting her hair salon off the ground. We established a routine to the point where we shared personal info with each other. She even told me her BF was a petty thief that robbed the pharmacy where he worked and sold drugs to dealers, and thought himself a gangster. I used to have her over to my place until one day she suggested I shouldn't escort her to where she parked on my street. She was afraid her BF was following her because of suspicions he had of her cheating on him. Obviously I cut that situation off.

Come to think of it she was a rare find, the sex was very satisfying compared to what I typically experienced with younger women. Then again, I suspect she developed feelings for me. BTW her physique and stature were very similar to yours, nice and thick, but she was a woman of color. Your council is wise and it'll be filed in my head for when the right opportunity presents itself.

Best regards,

Pops

 

[chumpmatic]

Pops, you also mention about these young providers not understanding basic protection from common transmitable things like candida, bacteria or UTI. It was an older man who told me what to look out for in my early days of sexual activity, I think that practice of teaching doesn't exist anymore due to our growing indifference and irrational shame. All woman who are sexually active should have Cystex and Balneol, handy, they are essentials in preventive care. As a caring confident older man you can pass that info along to underinformed younger ladies you encounter. There should be a handbook for these kind of issues.

I think the handbooks will come when they finally legalize the world oldest profession.
They really should get to it already.
One of the most basic human drives shouldn't be illegal.
This bullshit control and religion based stone age mentality is so outdated, especially in today's tech world. Women are finally serving on frontlines in the military, this shouldn't be too far behind.
The healthiest thing in the world for human beings, mentally, emotionally, and physically, is illegal.
Fucking nuts !

 

[fairemily]

Wow- interesting revelation. However, I very much doubt he was a client. Then again who knows, anything is possible. Broaching the subject of personal hygiene with an anonymous sexual encounter is not an easy matter. It is usually what happens between lovers, or people who see each other sexually on a regular basis. Yet, I do agree with you, when and if I do establish something of a regular thing with one of these younger women, if I find the holy grail of a mistress among them, i'll make it my personal responsibility to mentor her as best as I can.

On that note, this exchange made me reflect on my past encounters with young-un providers, and in a few cases did find myself in the role of older councilor. Unfortunately, some of the drama these girls get themselves into made them too much a liability. I remember one lady I wanted to assist in getting her hair salon off the ground. We established a routine to the point where we shared personal info with each other. She even told me her BF was a petty thief that robbed the pharmacy where he worked and sold drugs to dealers, and thought himself a gangster. I used to have her over to my place until one day she suggested I shouldn't escort her to where she parked on my street. She was afraid her BF was following her because of suspicions he had of her cheating on him. Obviously I cut that situation off.

Come to think of it she was a rare find, the sex was very satisfying compared to what I typically experienced with younger women. Then again, I suspect she developed feelings for me. BTW her physique and stature were very similar to yours, nice and thick, but she was a woman of color. Your council is wise and it'll be filed in my head for when the right opportunity presents itself.

Best regards,

Pops

Pops, he wasn't a client, he was an older man I had an affair with when I was in my late teens and he was in his mid thirties at the time, we met in a civilian setting. It was probably wrong in a jailbsit sense but I learned a lot of actual facts regarding sexuality and health that debunked all the foolish falsehoods I heard from my peers. He also had a caring approach to delicate subjects that made it less embarrassing for me, it really is the way you engage in these topics rather then the topic itself that makes all the difference, sensitivity and tone is key.

 

[popeye]

Haha- a how to handbook for the oldest profession in the world!!! I cannot wait to see who would publish it, who knows? Actually I believe it may exist on the shelves in a tomb of some ancient society. When younger, and much more scholarly, I used to run across the most amazing translations on books about human sexuality. Its amazing how much things may change over time yet still say the same. Human sexuality has been with us as long as humans have existed, yet attitudes about it are still in the dark ages. If you are familiar with the work of Margaret Mead, a social anthropologist, her observations of "primitive" people and their sexuality is quite interesting. It would seem modern humans are very prude when compared to our pagan ancestors. Or Westerners versus those in some developing cultures, especially in the far East Asian world.

Dealing with the far East Asian women providers through the years has expanded my thoughts about human sexuality. Perhaps it is due to their Buddhist upbringing, but most of these women while ashamed of their work are much less judgmental about what they do. They are very pragmatic and once they accept the situation do their best to protect themselves, each other, and the business. Regardless of the infighting that may occur amongst them. Then again they work together, as opposed to the independents that are the topic of this thread.

Perhaps once legalized the next step would be unionization. I cannot see a manual taking the place of learning like an apprentice from a seasoned provider. It always amazes how a woman transforms from sexually inexperienced to a professional provider. I have witnessed this over and over at places I've regularly visited through the years. The best providers always without exception are the ones the proprietess takes under her wing to teach tricks of the trade. This never fails.

Perhaps its time for us to open our own provider finishing school for the independent professional a haha!!!

Regards,

Pops

 

[popeye]

And yes sensitivity is key, but as I implied by me, such topics are best addressed between two people already intimate. Which brings up another point. Most of these younger providers do not seem to know how to be intimate. Obviously how can one fein intimacy if you have never experienced such a situation. Many of the independents seem I'll prepared, and unable to pretend to be emotionally engaged. The physical act is not "it" as much as the sense of making a guy feel like a king for the time he is with you. It is all a mind game.

Regards,

Pops

 

[popeye]

BTW I want to thank the moderator's for allowing this thoughtful exchange. I fear at least one or two cardinal rules have been broken. Nonetheless its been a wonderful chance for me to discuss something I truly cannot share anywhere else. Kind of like what brought me to these boards during its inception.

The new site is awesome, and I hope with it comes a new spirit of community.

Best regards to all,

Pops

 

[puffin]

I have had terrific experiences with younger providers. Personally I have no desire to feign intimacy, but I do appreciate an honest conversation. Older providers assume that there is or will be a desire for an emotional bond with a client strays from the script whereas a younger one is more comfortable with the idea of two friendly people having sex on occasion.

The older pros have an Outback Steakhouse menu down pat, and there is no way they will veer from that script. Younger ones might accept an invite to dinner, shoot the breeze and then take care of business. When you meet a young girl socially a kiss on the cheek is just that, nothing more or less; It's all easy breezy for the younger girls and needlessly complicated for the older ones.

 

[annryce]

Best sex partner I ever had was 24 and quite the hipster with a little bone through her nose and only slight trimming. She was sexy in an earthy womanly way, strong willed yet never gratuitously snarky.

I think the young girls today are more inclined to see sex as simply a biologically motivated act devoid of political statement, which was not the case twenty or more years ago. I am constantly on the lookout for the rare provider who wants some extra cash, but is not compelled to put herself out there to such an extent that she is looking to get things over with. That is to say, going through as many clients as possible before she pays her bills (or visits her supplier).

Such women are rare yes, and perhaps I would give up the search, were it not for three really seriously sexy women I met who were fun all night. Crazy as it sounds, finding that combination is not very different than dating. In fact I came across something a few days ago, but though she called herself curvy, the curve it was all sphere and no waist. In fact she already has medical problems and was texting me with updates. I was ready to take her home the night we met, but she deferred, when she texted me later with an offer, I was sober, so I nixed that.

Yes, she was a fun girl, but the idea of paying for it. Nah, I'll pass.

Where were you when I was 18? LOL What happens to girls like that is they either go the sugar baby route, avoid adult entertainment altogether while secretly pining for a Rich Prince Charming, or aim for being a low volume classy escort since the above bolded is not financially practical (or sustainable!) for a young girl who needs cash but finds traditional avenues too sleazy. Those girls are like the men who browse review boards but never post-they prefer the sidelines over the direct action...and will only act when they feel they can trust the person propositioning.

What popeye is saying is accurate. It's a problem endemic to sales, not just the hobby. People are too lazy to market themselves properly and instead of finding the clients that like them, trust them, and want to do business, they cast a wide net trying to appeal to everyone because they're scared that no one will buy. To this day, I have that fear. Successful people hear that voice and use that as a motivation to provide better service.

There's that little voice inside every salesperson's head, "If I do this, will I stop getting calls? Will no one like me? What will my friends think?" Whenever that voice is louder than, "I want to make an impact on some one's life today...I want to provide an awesome experience to clients who value me...I'm excited about work because I work with fun people..." poor service and lowest common denominator thinking occurs.

 

[Monk]

Popeye, while I respect your observations and I'm sure you're being sincere, do you think some of what you're experiencing might simply be explained by nostalgia? It's true, the power relationship in this hobby has been altered by digital media. Providers can be much more discriminating in who they see and what they're willing to do these days. But, my experience suggests that young, inexperienced and independent providers offer more or less similar services today as they did before the information age. Looking back, I do remember some of my earlier experiences fondly. But, I was younger then, too, more energetic, more athletic—frankly, more able to enjoy sex and less experienced so I was more willing to overlook issues that, with experience I wouldn't be willing to overlook today.

Years ago someone on this board made the point (and I'm not quoting directly): Basically, I'm in this hobby because I love to fuck young women, and so do you. When all is said and done, I have yet to honestly disprove that statement.

(BTW, it's great to see both you and Em posting. And as to why the moderators haven't touched this discussion, it's probably more or less UTR. Almost no one reads this section of the board these days—or, at least, that's my impression.)