Vaccine Passports

[genius]

One of the things I got when I finished boot camp many, many moons ago, was a little yellow booklet that was a record of all the vaccines Uncle Sam was kind enough to give me. Although I didn't need it for travel (only certain countries required proof of certain vaccinations and I wasn't interested in going to those countries), but it was nice to know I was vaccinated against bubonic plaque given some of the establishments I have been to over the years (yup, that was one of the vaccinations I got).

I do not feel that everyone should be required to get the vaccine. However I see no problem (legal or ethical) allowing that proof of vaccination be required for certain activities. I would think that the requirement for quarantine when traveling form virus hotspots would be waived if one ha been vaccinated.

For example Quantas Airways will require passengers to show proof of vaccination when making international flights.

Whether this will happen with theaters, restuarants, sports arenas, etc., who knows.

I happen to think that the requirement is a good idea.

An article in Lancet made the case for issuing some sort of proof of vaccination, e.g., wristband, or certificate (paper or in an app) proving vaccination.

What say you all?

 

[billyS]

I think the tin foil hat crowd and the "I'm an American, I have my rights/ Freedom" crowd will have a field day with that.

Anti-vaxers (most of whom belong to both groups above) will never go for that.

Also I can see a market developing for fake wristbands or certificates.

 

[Nehoma]

One of the things I got when I finished boot camp many, many moons ago, was a little yellow booklet that was a record of all the vaccines Uncle Sam was kind enough to give me. Although I didn't need it for travel (only certain countries required proof of certain vaccinations and I wasn't interested in going to those countries), but it was nice to know I was vaccinated against bubonic plaque given some of the establishments I have been to over the years (yup, that was one of the vaccinations I got).

I do not feel that everyone should be required to get the vaccine. However I see no problem (legal or ethical) allowing that proof of vaccination be required for certain activities. I would think that the requirement for quarantine when traveling form virus hotspots would be waived if one ha been vaccinated.

For example Quantas Airways will require passengers to show proof of vaccination when making international flights.

Whether this will happen with theaters, restuarants, sports arenas, etc., who knows.

I happen to think that the requirement is a good idea.

An article in Lancet made the case for issuing some sort of proof of vaccination, e.g., wristband, or certificate (paper or in an app) proving vaccination.

What say you all?

Fuck em..I guess I won't be traveling..or arenas..or whatever!

 

[trader1]

I agree with both Genius and BillyS

I suspect that both politics and the naysayers will both play a big part in weather or not the vaccine or proof of vaccination is required to travel etc.. A Herculean task and I’m sure fraud will run rampant

 

[genius]

I think the tin foil hat crowd and the "I'm an American, I have my rights/ Freedom" crowd will have a field day with that.

Anti-vaxers (most of whom belong to both groups above) will never go for that....

I don't see how anyone's rights would be violated. I thought that the only discrimination that is forbidden is discrimination by age, race, creed, national origin, sex (and sexual orientation?).

For example restaurants could deny service to anyone who didn’t meet certain dress codes. Public schools don't allow students in if they don't have certain vaccinations. Libraries can eject people for not obeying noise rules.

IAlso I can see a market developing for fake wristbands or certificates.

Wouldn't be just easier to get the vaccine? That said there are steps that can be taken to make fake certs difficult to make and obtain

 

[yonkershobbyist]

I agree, at least private businesses should be able to require it the way "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service" is. No flat-earthers really go bananas over that one taking away their freedom for some reason.

 

[Bricktop]

I think the tin foil hat crowd and the "I'm an American, I have my rights/ Freedom" crowd will have a field day with that.

Anti-vaxers (most of whom belong to both groups above) will never go for that.

Also I can see a market developing for fake wristbands or certificates.

I see drivers license as the most secure path to vaccines proof

 

[billyS]

I see drivers license as the most secure path to vaccines proof

How so?
Are you saying that they somehow mark our DL if we've been vaccinated?
What about people without DL?
I'm not sure about the logistics of that. DMV is overwhelmed as it is.

 

[Bricktop]

How so?
Are you saying that they somehow mark our DL if we've been vaccinated?
What about people without DL?
I'm not sure about the logistics of that. DMV is overwhelmed as it is.

They have a state ID if you don’t have DL. Same as if you want the enhanced ID. It would have to be done by mail however.

 

[Pride o Cucamonga]

One of the things I got when I finished boot camp many, many moons ago, was a little yellow booklet that was a record of all the vaccines Uncle Sam was kind enough to give me. Although I didn't need it for travel (only certain countries required proof of certain vaccinations and I wasn't interested in going to those countries), but it was nice to know I was vaccinated against bubonic plaque given some of the establishments I have been to over the years (yup, that was one of the vaccinations I got).

I do not feel that everyone should be required to get the vaccine. However I see no problem (legal or ethical) allowing that proof of vaccination be required for certain activities. I would think that the requirement for quarantine when traveling form virus hotspots would be waived if one ha been vaccinated.

For example Quantas Airways will require passengers to show proof of vaccination when making international flights.

Whether this will happen with theaters, restuarants, sports arenas, etc., who knows.

I happen to think that the requirement is a good idea.

An article in Lancet made the case for issuing some sort of proof of vaccination, e.g., wristband, or certificate (paper or in an app) proving vaccination.

What say you all?

Over the course of my life I have seen many things change, often not for the better from my perspective. It is sad that my children and their children will never know the freedoms we enjoyed throughout the 50's 60's and 70's. While I am not for more rules or regulations or the idea that we all should be digitized, this health issue goes beyond that as a survival of the species issue going forward. This isn't the place it was 10 months ago and if new restrictions in some form are not adopted then what we are experiencing now may only be a taste of what may come. From what I have read thus far it would appear that the vaccination may not be the cure all we are hoping for anyway but until we sort it all out in the future I think this step is necessary to prepare us for the reality that our cozy existence isn't all warm and fuzzy anymore.

 

[billyS]

Over the course of my life I have seen many things change, often not for the better from my perspective. It is sad that my children and their children will never know the freedoms we enjoyed throughout the 50's 60's and 70's. While I am not for more rules or regulations or the idea that we all should be digitized, this health issue goes beyond that as a survival of the species issue going forward. This isn't the place it was 10 months ago and if new restrictions in some form are not adopted then what we are experiencing now may only be a taste of what may come. From what I have read thus far it would appear that the vaccination may not be the cure all we are hoping for anyway but until we sort it all out in the future I think this step is necessary to prepare us for the reality that our cozy existence isn't all warm and fuzzy anymore.

Agreed @Pride o Cucamonga .
Actually our existence hasn't been cozy since 9/11 and we have to take our shoes off to get on a plane.

 

[genius]

Over the course of my life I have seen many things change, often not for the better from my perspective. It is sad that my children and their children will never know the freedoms we enjoyed throughout the 50's 60's and 70's. While I am not for more rules or regulations or the idea that we all should be digitized, this health issue goes beyond that as a survival of the species issue going forward. This isn't the place it was 10 months ago and if new restrictions in some form are not adopted then what we are experiencing now may only be a taste of what may come. From what I have read thus far it would appear that the vaccination may not be the cure all we are hoping for anyway but until we sort it all out in the future I think this step is necessary to prepare us for the reality that our cozy existence isn't all warm and fuzzy anymore.

Sometimes the good old days weren't as good as the good old days.
Some things that weren't all so hot back then that are better now:

50,60, up to mid 70's

Then: getting a letter from the US gov't instructing you to report for military duty, without your consent, training you for 22 weeks on how to survive being shot at, rocket attacked, trip mine blown up (Korea and Vietnam). Pay, as I recall started at $60/per month (1970) but you got a brand new uniform, underwear, socks, a nice big canvas bag to store them in and boots (boots had a steel plate in the sole so if you stepped on a hidden sharpened shit coated bamboo stick it didn't drive thru you foot), free room and board (3 meals a day and either a barracks of a nice cozy tent to sleep in.)
Now: If you choose to enter the military and pick the right branch, the pay ain't bad, you can get training for a useful skill.

Then: if you were black and lived in the south (or south Boston) as a kid you would go to a segregated school that was falling apart. If you lead a protest the all white police would either club you or let the dogs loose on you. Don't even think of running for office or eating at a lunch counter.
Now: Most of the south has a percentage of minority legislators, police and schools the a not segregated.

Would you like a few more examples?

 

[imameathead]

I say leave it up to private businesses to require the vaccination. Making it a government requirement instantly makes it a political topic.

 

[trader1]

I say leave it up to private businesses to require the vaccination. Making it a government requirement instantly makes it a political topic.

I agree with this somewhat..
Some very valid points in the past few threads...Both for and against proof..
To have drivers licenses or other form of Government ID showing proof of vaccination.. A nightmare- Too much room for fraud, red tape and dissent. DMV alone cannot handle routine matters- To ask them to take on this responsibility- never happen—

And if I do not have proof?
What civil liberties could be taken away?

There are to many uncertainties, unknowns IMO at this point ..

 

[Bricktop]

I say leave it up to private businesses to require the vaccination. Making it a government requirement instantly makes it a political topic.

This is a National security issue.

 

[hunter818]

And if I do not have proof?
What civil liberties could be taken away?

It doesn't sound like civil liberties would be taken away. You want to enroll your kid in public school? Show proof of vaccinations. You want to enroll in/dorm at a particular University? Show proof of vaccinations. This is the world we are already living in.

What's being discussed here is the potential for businesses (Disney World, airlines, sporting venues, movie theaters, etc.) to have people show proof of vaccination. I don't have an issue with a business setting standards for who they allow in, and as has be mentioned already, this is already something businesses do.

As it is we are already monitored by hundreds of cameras with facial recognition technology and license plate readers that track our whereabouts. We have security theater in most major transportation hubs and have to empty our pockets and walk through body scanners (that may save the images taken) while waiting for the folks with GEDs give us the go-ahead to proceed.

Of course some folks will bitch and moan and whine about this like they have since being told to wear a mask when shopping in the middle of a pandemic. That's not my concern. Businesses will do as they see fit, and for some requiring proof of vaccination will be the way to go.

 

[Pride o Cucamonga]

Sometimes the good old days weren't as good as the good old days.
Some things that weren't all so hot back then that are better now:

50,60, up to mid 70's

Then: getting a letter from the US gov't instructing you to report for military duty, without your consent, training you for 22 weeks on how to survive being shot at, rocket attacked, trip mine blown up (Korea and Vietnam). Pay, as I recall started at $60/per month (1970) but you got a brand new uniform, underwear, socks, a nice big canvas bag to store them in and boots (boots had a steel plate in the sole so if you stepped on a hidden sharpened shit coated bamboo stick it didn't drive thru you foot), free room and board (3 meals a day and either a barracks of a nice cozy tent to sleep in.)
Now: If you choose to enter the military and pick the right branch, the pay ain't bad, you can get training for a useful skill.

Then: if you were black and lived in the south (or south Boston) as a kid you would go to a segregated school that was falling apart. If you lead a protest the all white police would either club you or let the dogs loose on you. Don't even think of running for office or eating at a lunch counter.
Now: Most of the south has a percentage of minority legislators, police and schools the a not segregated.

Would you like a few more examples?

If you need to get that off your chest then please feel free to give more examples. I am truly sorry your memories of those 20 plus years are so bleak, you got drafted, only earned $720 a year and had to live in a tent. It sounds like it had negative effects on your entire life. You started this convo about vaccines. In the context of replying to that topic I mentioned that my children and their children will never know the many freedoms I enjoyed coming up, like hopping on a plane without being body scanned or photographing the entrance to the QMT without fear of arrest or not having to have my passport stamped for vaccinations that I have received for instance. So in keeping with that topic of vaccine restrictions I stated that perhaps new restrictions on travel may be necessary for the safety of the population at large.

If you would like to start a new topic about The Good Old Days weren't all that good and tomorrow ain't as bad as it seems then perhaps we can take that convo furthur.

 

[MayorSimpleton]

I agree with this somewhat..
Some very valid points in the past few threads...Both for and against proof..
To have drivers licenses or other form of Government ID showing proof of vaccination.. A nightmare- Too much room for fraud, red tape and dissent. DMV alone cannot handle routine matters- To ask them to take on this responsibility- never happen—

And if I do not have proof?
What civil liberties could be taken away?

There are to many uncertainties, unknowns IMO at this point ..

I know!! We can make 666 on everyone's forehead !!!

 

[Slinky Bender]

Tell people if they want whatever the next stimulus payments are they need proof of vaccination.

 

[MayorSimpleton]

Tell people if they want whatever the next stimulus payments are they need proof of vaccination.

That'll do it.