Screening Workaround?
- Thread starter Monk
- Start date
I have taken the third option.
I am not sure whether the second one works. At least not with many independent providers who would rather accept referrals only from other indies. Someone correct me if I am wrong on this one.
I am not sure whether the second one works. At least not with many independent providers who would rather accept referrals only from other indies. Someone correct me if I am wrong on this one.
I think I was pretty clear on what a bad date consists of. I am not talking about slandering someone over a stupid cyber argument or someone who walks out in the case of a bait/switch. Please don't put words in my mouth.
A bad date is someone who is abusive verbally or physically, a ripoff or has a disease. The person has pose a risk to me somehow.
If a guy was just an asshole to me, I wouldnt call him a bad date per se. He was just a pain in ass and I wouldnt bother to see him again. If he was unbearably rude, I would probably ask him to leave. End of story.
Its not worth the time to put him on a bad date list. However, there may be women out there who would. I dont know. However, I don't feel sorry for anyone who slanders another person and then complains about the consequences of thier actions. We have time to think about what we type here.
A bad date is someone who is abusive verbally or physically, a ripoff or has a disease. The person has pose a risk to me somehow.
If a guy was just an asshole to me, I wouldnt call him a bad date per se. He was just a pain in ass and I wouldnt bother to see him again. If he was unbearably rude, I would probably ask him to leave. End of story.
Its not worth the time to put him on a bad date list. However, there may be women out there who would. I dont know. However, I don't feel sorry for anyone who slanders another person and then complains about the consequences of thier actions. We have time to think about what we type here.
And it seems to me that under your definition of a "bad date" would fall a guy who makes an appointment with someone who totally misrepresents herself (fake pics, misstated age, weight, etc) and walks when she opens the door and he sees that what he is getting is not what he bargained for (very current example: http://utopiaguide.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36109).
In addition, there is plenty of "passing along" of client info among providers under lots of different circumstances. If you spend a good amount of time hanging out with groups of women in the business, you hear all sorts of information about all sorts of guys who would be horrified to learn that this was being discussed. So, armed with that info, all that has to happen is some cyber-argument over something stupid, and the guy can get hit from left field by someone who he has never seen, and therefore can't be a bad client, unless, again, one of your definitions of "bad client" is someone who would dare say anything bad, rude, etc. to some woman on a message board in the heat of a disagreement.
None of the above should be taken as a statement that women do not have the right to screen their customers; but the concept that a guy "has nothing to worry about" unless he is "bad customer" has been disproved more than a few times in the past few years, with some pretty horrific circumstances to some guys who were never anything but good customers.
In addition, there is plenty of "passing along" of client info among providers under lots of different circumstances. If you spend a good amount of time hanging out with groups of women in the business, you hear all sorts of information about all sorts of guys who would be horrified to learn that this was being discussed. So, armed with that info, all that has to happen is some cyber-argument over something stupid, and the guy can get hit from left field by someone who he has never seen, and therefore can't be a bad client, unless, again, one of your definitions of "bad client" is someone who would dare say anything bad, rude, etc. to some woman on a message board in the heat of a disagreement.
None of the above should be taken as a statement that women do not have the right to screen their customers; but the concept that a guy "has nothing to worry about" unless he is "bad customer" has been disproved more than a few times in the past few years, with some pretty horrific circumstances to some guys who were never anything but good customers.
I think I was pretty clear on what a bad date consists of. I am not talking about slandering someone over a stupid cyber argument or someone who walks out in the case of a bait/switch. Please don't put words in my mouth.
A bad date is someone who is abusive verbally or physically, a ripoff or has a disease. The person has pose a risk to me somehow.
A bad date is someone who is abusive verbally or physically, a ripoff or has a disease. The person has pose a risk to me somehow.
However, I don't feel sorry for anyone who slanders another person and then complains about the consequences of thier actions.
Just to be clear, I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. I've read your post three times and this seams to be what you're saying. I just want to be sure that I'm reading it correctly.
^^^Arrgh!
To clarify, "verbally abusive" in such a way that I feel threatened. Abuse is abuse. If someone threatens me, I have a right to take cautionary action (ie legally, warning others about this person on a bad date board, telling other providers).
Completely unrelated:
When I said "slander" I meant just that. To talk crap in a public forum about another person. If I say negative things about so and so on this forum, and consequently my business tanks. I cant really be mad because, well, I started it.
If I said, "hey JL, you stink!" that is not slander. I am just being a jerk. It doesnt warrant anything more than hitting the ignore button.
Besides, I will tell you to your face that you're an asshole. I am not going to spread some stupid rumor or post some personal info on internet. Many posters (male and female) on these boards play "internet thug" and then wonder why shit hits the fan. Why say anything you would not say in person?
All I really mean is use common sense. Some people are good, some people are fucking nuts.
To clarify, "verbally abusive" in such a way that I feel threatened. Abuse is abuse. If someone threatens me, I have a right to take cautionary action (ie legally, warning others about this person on a bad date board, telling other providers).
Completely unrelated:
When I said "slander" I meant just that. To talk crap in a public forum about another person. If I say negative things about so and so on this forum, and consequently my business tanks. I cant really be mad because, well, I started it.
If I said, "hey JL, you stink!" that is not slander. I am just being a jerk. It doesnt warrant anything more than hitting the ignore button.
Besides, I will tell you to your face that you're an asshole. I am not going to spread some stupid rumor or post some personal info on internet. Many posters (male and female) on these boards play "internet thug" and then wonder why shit hits the fan. Why say anything you would not say in person?
All I really mean is use common sense. Some people are good, some people are fucking nuts.
Candice, I'm going to ask you to believe that I'm not being intentionally dense to make a point, but am actually still unclear.
When you say "slander," you don't mean like if I were to write a generally favorable review of you but say you had some cottage cheese in your thighs and ass, right?
(NOTE: Obviously I've never seen Candice and have no reason to believe she's anything but physically flawless. This is just a HYPO.)
When you say "slander," you don't mean like if I were to write a generally favorable review of you but say you had some cottage cheese in your thighs and ass, right?
(NOTE: Obviously I've never seen Candice and have no reason to believe she's anything but physically flawless. This is just a HYPO.)
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I've been thinking about the "old school" madams you and franca have referred to. And that system, as I understand it, was different in a key way.
There, referrals (if I understand correctly) came from other johns, who the new john would generally have known from non-whoring contexts. In other words, guys recommended other guys they knew who they trusted. And guys also only recommended madams they'd come to trust to other guys. What this system DIDN'T require was a guy's giving his personal information to someone he didn't know who's involved with him in a criminal enterprise.*
To me, that makes a big huge difference. I understand why you feel you need this "new commonplace," but I'm just not playing.
There, referrals (if I understand correctly) came from other johns, who the new john would generally have known from non-whoring contexts. In other words, guys recommended other guys they knew who they trusted. And guys also only recommended madams they'd come to trust to other guys. What this system DIDN'T require was a guy's giving his personal information to someone he didn't know who's involved with him in a criminal enterprise.*
To me, that makes a big huge difference. I understand why you feel you need this "new commonplace," but I'm just not playing.
And, even with the "old school" system, you still can't be sure that the madam your buddy recommended, who you are giving your personal information to isn't batshit crazy.
Seriously, if I told you what she required of a new client who came in for an interview, you'd choke on your ant egg enchilada.
Candice, I'm going to ask you to believe that I'm not being intentionally dense to make a point, but am actually still unclear.
When you say "slander," you don't mean like if I were to write a generally favorable review of you but say you had some cottage cheese in your thighs and ass, right?
(NOTE: Obviously I've never seen Candice and have no reason to believe she's anything but physically flawless. This is just a HYPO.)
When you say "slander," you don't mean like if I were to write a generally favorable review of you but say you had some cottage cheese in your thighs and ass, right?
(NOTE: Obviously I've never seen Candice and have no reason to believe she's anything but physically flawless. This is just a HYPO.)
But no, I wouldnt consider that slander (if its true). I consider that splitting hairs, lol.
^^^Arrgh!
To clarify, "verbally abusive" in such a way that I feel threatened. Abuse is abuse. If someone threatens me, I have a right to take cautionary action (ie legally, warning others about this person on a bad date board, telling other providers).
Completely unrelated:
When I said "slander" I meant just that. To talk crap in a public forum about another person. If I say negative things about so and so on this forum, and consequently my business tanks. I cant really be mad because, well, I started it.
If I said, "hey JL, you stink!" that is not slander. I am just being a jerk. It doesnt warrant anything more than hitting the ignore button.
Besides, I will tell you to your face that you're an asshole. I am not going to spread some stupid rumor or post some personal info on internet. Many posters (male and female) on these boards play "internet thug" and then wonder why shit hits the fan. Why say anything you would not say in person?
All I really mean is use common sense. Some people are good, some people are fucking nuts.
To clarify, "verbally abusive" in such a way that I feel threatened. Abuse is abuse. If someone threatens me, I have a right to take cautionary action (ie legally, warning others about this person on a bad date board, telling other providers).
Completely unrelated:
When I said "slander" I meant just that. To talk crap in a public forum about another person. If I say negative things about so and so on this forum, and consequently my business tanks. I cant really be mad because, well, I started it.
If I said, "hey JL, you stink!" that is not slander. I am just being a jerk. It doesnt warrant anything more than hitting the ignore button.
Besides, I will tell you to your face that you're an asshole. I am not going to spread some stupid rumor or post some personal info on internet. Many posters (male and female) on these boards play "internet thug" and then wonder why shit hits the fan. Why say anything you would not say in person?
All I really mean is use common sense. Some people are good, some people are fucking nuts.
In terms of slandering someone on a public forum, the lawyers will probably correct me here (or, at least, split hairs), but I believe that the definition usually entails "malicious intent." In other words, if someone says something intentionally trying to ruin your reputation, then it would be considered slander. If someone just says something stupid, then that's all it is; rude and ignorant.
If a guy writes "fuck you, you stupid bitch" in an e*mail, that's one thing. You blow it off, and be thankful you didn't meet the SOB. Verbal abuse in person, alone with the abuser, behind closed doors is fucking scary. Like Candace said, abuse is abuse. And on top of that, you don't know if the person is going to lose control and start getting physical. If somebody behaves like that in a session, I think it is justifiable to post him to an escort-only blacklist.
I think what justlooking is looking for has remained unanswered. Would the escorts blacklist someone based on a honest but not positive review?
Maybe we should use "libel" instead of "slander". Considering that libel corresponds to the written form of a defamation (e.g. a review). "Slander" is more when you say something, used quite often because of TV. In our case, the word of mouth hurts, but it remains with limited effects and is hard to prove.
Maybe we should use "libel" instead of "slander". Considering that libel corresponds to the written form of a defamation (e.g. a review). "Slander" is more when you say something, used quite often because of TV. In our case, the word of mouth hurts, but it remains with limited effects and is hard to prove.
I totally understand the need for a provider to decide on what level of screening they feel necessary to make them safe. Likewise, a hobbyist should decide if they are willing to take a chance, or find someone else.... as stated earlier, the free market will provide acceptable balance to both supply and demand sides.
BUT for the providers that think the hobbyists are overreacting, or the hobbyist quick to spill lots of personal info, the following is true....
I was once asked for JUST a full name and town, that was all, plus the promise to quickly flash any ID that matched later. I figured better then a phone #, plus my info was unlisted, so I really thought this was really minimally invasive. I ended up becoming friendly with the provider, and later asked how on earth that was any kind of safety net. My new friend laughed, and proceeded to tell me my SS#, my DOB, my unlisted home # and address, my SO's name, SS#, and DOB...... need I continue?
After my shock was over, using my infinite charm, I found out how, and was clearly not thrilled, but that ship had sailed.
I truly doubt that info was really ever discarded, despite being told otherwise, and although I consider her a friend to this day, the risk to me, was clearly not worth it.
Had the provider not been a great person, I would have been vulnerable to a lot of nasty stuff that was WAY above my level of acceptability.
I shared this because, as pointed out earlier, there have been plenty of public disclosures, including a recent southern senator.
So for the providers out there, I think most here respect your needs to be safe, but it definitely cuts both ways... and it is not just being overly paranoid to have an issue with screening....
BUT for the providers that think the hobbyists are overreacting, or the hobbyist quick to spill lots of personal info, the following is true....
I was once asked for JUST a full name and town, that was all, plus the promise to quickly flash any ID that matched later. I figured better then a phone #, plus my info was unlisted, so I really thought this was really minimally invasive. I ended up becoming friendly with the provider, and later asked how on earth that was any kind of safety net. My new friend laughed, and proceeded to tell me my SS#, my DOB, my unlisted home # and address, my SO's name, SS#, and DOB...... need I continue?
After my shock was over, using my infinite charm, I found out how, and was clearly not thrilled, but that ship had sailed.
I truly doubt that info was really ever discarded, despite being told otherwise, and although I consider her a friend to this day, the risk to me, was clearly not worth it.
Had the provider not been a great person, I would have been vulnerable to a lot of nasty stuff that was WAY above my level of acceptability.
I shared this because, as pointed out earlier, there have been plenty of public disclosures, including a recent southern senator.
So for the providers out there, I think most here respect your needs to be safe, but it definitely cuts both ways... and it is not just being overly paranoid to have an issue with screening....