Obama and Drone Warfare
- Thread starter mrtaiwan
- Start date
> I know what is reality and what is fiction
Drone killings - Psychopath.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy
Drone killings - Psychopath.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy
> inanimate killing machines
That would be the President. Quoting the liberal media of record:
Drones, Obama administration’s claim: "courts have no power over targeted drone killings of American citizens overseas."
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/20/u...aims-on-authority-in-drone-killings.html?_r=0
"Judge [Rosemary M.] Collyer (age 67) said she was “troubled” by the government’s assertion that it could kill American citizens it designated as dangerous, with no role for courts to review the decision."
That would be the President. Quoting the liberal media of record:
Drones, Obama administration’s claim: "courts have no power over targeted drone killings of American citizens overseas."
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/20/u...aims-on-authority-in-drone-killings.html?_r=0
"Judge [Rosemary M.] Collyer (age 67) said she was “troubled” by the government’s assertion that it could kill American citizens it designated as dangerous, with no role for courts to review the decision."
You seem like my lIberal friends, at least you have a substantial argument I cannot discredit, you are right drones are barbaric. If you like we can also go down the list of left leaning criticisms like allowing Monsanto full power without penalty of legal recourse, not legalizing cannabis, opening up more global trading devaluing the American worker, not pushing healthcare reform to single payer and of course the drone situation, they are legitimate qualms unlike bitching about a slow website.
He is not perfect, there has never been a perfect president, they all have flaws but he's a remarkable man and far from a psychopath. A psychopath is a man of significant means and puts the family dog on the roof of the car for 12 hours at high speed to go on vacation, a psychopath impersonates a state trooper in an uniform obtained by his governor father and harress unsuspecting motorists, a psychopath attacks a smaller person and forcablely cuts his hair while he begs for mercy in tears, we almost had a psychopath occupying the White House but luckily he's spending his time in his 12 mansions bought by outsourcing American jobs instead.
No American president has left office without blood on their hands especially two of the greats, Lincoln and FDR. it's a dirty job and many times they have to choose the lesser of two evils, I wouldn't want to be in his shoes for a second.
He is not perfect, there has never been a perfect president, they all have flaws but he's a remarkable man and far from a psychopath. A psychopath is a man of significant means and puts the family dog on the roof of the car for 12 hours at high speed to go on vacation, a psychopath impersonates a state trooper in an uniform obtained by his governor father and harress unsuspecting motorists, a psychopath attacks a smaller person and forcablely cuts his hair while he begs for mercy in tears, we almost had a psychopath occupying the White House but luckily he's spending his time in his 12 mansions bought by outsourcing American jobs instead.
No American president has left office without blood on their hands especially two of the greats, Lincoln and FDR. it's a dirty job and many times they have to choose the lesser of two evils, I wouldn't want to be in his shoes for a second.
Mr Taiwan, I just got into a whole to do about the president with close family member regarding Monsanto, she equates the passing of the law to WWIII because in her view it will destroys the bees and humans will lose the ability to grow produce naturally. I couldn't argue with her since she is 100% correct and although I believe although I could not convince her Romney would have not only signed Monsanto but added in the Keystone. I'm not sure your leanings but outside of Rand Paul drones are one of the few bi-partisan policies that all moderate Republicans support. It's an unpleasant solution to stopping extremists who want to kill us hiding in regions we have no access or extrication. There is no way we will go into places like Somilia unless it's to save hostages which the president approved despite the fact nobody mentions it.
http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203806504577182422284560592?mobile=y
http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203806504577182422284560592?mobile=y
Obama could stop the drones at any time. But it seems he has no spine to stand up to the status quo killing / spying / welfare machine. His lack of backbone and focus on self-preservation is reflective of most of the political class. There's nothing there to admire, please trust me on this. You could look at his circle of friends and come to the same conclusion. Meanwhile he has his own children. Killing is just not justifiable, full stop.
Monsanto, bad, but the situation will self-correct, keep the faith and standby.
Cannabis - one of my pet peeves since 1982. A Ph.D. Sociologist friend assures me this will also self correct.
Global Trade - fraud, Clinton opened the floodgates and stated the whole mess. Ross Perot and Sir James ********* were prescient. Remember, I am mrtaiwan, I know the Asian brain, they never had/have any intention to trade "fairly".
Healthcare - a huge mess
Drones - murder. In the rank ordering of the above, murder tops the list.
Psychopathy and Sociopathy are complex because the individuals don't voluntarily check-in for self-diagnosis in the absence of incarceration, so not much scientific consensus exists. I have close family members who fit into these definitions but lack having been incarcerated. Normal people simply can not murder others - your internal systems will cause you to break down.
Lincoln - if you grew up north of the Potomac River you have one opinion, if you grew up south of the Potomac River you look at Lincoln very differently.
FDR - not my kind of person. Teddy Roosevelt - two thumbs up, skinny dipping in the Potomac and boxing in the White House while President!
Put your faith in men and women who stand the test of time, like Gandhi or Jesus or your favorite hero. The political class in most of the world are truly revolting people. Meet a few of them up close, face-to-face, and you'll agree - I promise.
Monsanto, bad, but the situation will self-correct, keep the faith and standby.
Cannabis - one of my pet peeves since 1982. A Ph.D. Sociologist friend assures me this will also self correct.
Global Trade - fraud, Clinton opened the floodgates and stated the whole mess. Ross Perot and Sir James ********* were prescient. Remember, I am mrtaiwan, I know the Asian brain, they never had/have any intention to trade "fairly".
Healthcare - a huge mess
Drones - murder. In the rank ordering of the above, murder tops the list.
Psychopathy and Sociopathy are complex because the individuals don't voluntarily check-in for self-diagnosis in the absence of incarceration, so not much scientific consensus exists. I have close family members who fit into these definitions but lack having been incarcerated. Normal people simply can not murder others - your internal systems will cause you to break down.
Lincoln - if you grew up north of the Potomac River you have one opinion, if you grew up south of the Potomac River you look at Lincoln very differently.
FDR - not my kind of person. Teddy Roosevelt - two thumbs up, skinny dipping in the Potomac and boxing in the White House while President!
Put your faith in men and women who stand the test of time, like Gandhi or Jesus or your favorite hero. The political class in most of the world are truly revolting people. Meet a few of them up close, face-to-face, and you'll agree - I promise.
It's better to look at the root causes of the killing by extremists, and to have a realistic cost/benefit analysis that's vetted by number crunchers, not war-mongers.
I recommend [the late] Chalmers' Johnson's book "Blowback", published before 9-11. Johnson laid out the case that all the proactive killing of terrorists by the USA simply creates the fuel for the next large-scale unexpected violent operation. Chalmer was a Ph.D. in Asian studies from Berkeley, fluent in Japanese, a China scholar, former CIA consultant, etc. He was ridiculed before 9-11, and after 9-11 the book became popular.
Please note that you're making an assumption that the powers that be are actually competent, which they're not. Just examine their records of individual or group achievement. Few could ever hold a job in the private sector that didn't lean on their government contacts and experience. One of the great secrets of life is that there is no "A Team". The A Team is you and me and those of us who wake up each day and decide to be the A Team.
Finally, note that the Ottoman Empire has been expanding by force for well over 1,000 years. Keep a sense of time and proportion. A few drones are hardly going to stop 1,000 years of violence by a group that today numbers a few hundred million able bodied men.
I recommend [the late] Chalmers' Johnson's book "Blowback", published before 9-11. Johnson laid out the case that all the proactive killing of terrorists by the USA simply creates the fuel for the next large-scale unexpected violent operation. Chalmer was a Ph.D. in Asian studies from Berkeley, fluent in Japanese, a China scholar, former CIA consultant, etc. He was ridiculed before 9-11, and after 9-11 the book became popular.
Please note that you're making an assumption that the powers that be are actually competent, which they're not. Just examine their records of individual or group achievement. Few could ever hold a job in the private sector that didn't lean on their government contacts and experience. One of the great secrets of life is that there is no "A Team". The A Team is you and me and those of us who wake up each day and decide to be the A Team.
Finally, note that the Ottoman Empire has been expanding by force for well over 1,000 years. Keep a sense of time and proportion. A few drones are hardly going to stop 1,000 years of violence by a group that today numbers a few hundred million able bodied men.
I do admit that I like Obama's use of drones. Otherwise carpet bombing and any other types of military action to take out targets have higher collateral damage. Drones are far more efficient. I like that no US soldiers are endangered and we get to kill pieces of crap that are planning and/or have already killed Americans. We should use more drones and less soldiers.
Actually ... just to clarify ... we should do the following:
#1. develope all of our natural energy resources: natural gas drilling, Keystone pipeline (It's OK to buy from Canada), off shore drilling in the gulf, nuclear energy and solar/wind.
#2. Once energy independent - close all embassies and consulates in the middle east and other muslim countries and never ever go back.
#3. Until that happens use drones to kill as many of the bad guys as possible. Make it a television series and have the commercials help pay for the drones!
Actually ... just to clarify ... we should do the following:
#1. develope all of our natural energy resources: natural gas drilling, Keystone pipeline (It's OK to buy from Canada), off shore drilling in the gulf, nuclear energy and solar/wind.
#2. Once energy independent - close all embassies and consulates in the middle east and other muslim countries and never ever go back.
#3. Until that happens use drones to kill as many of the bad guys as possible. Make it a television series and have the commercials help pay for the drones!
I actually agree with the drone program because I believe religious fanatics want to end civilization (all religious fanatics) but the conservatives on the board keep insisting I'm a radical left wing extremists. Mr Tawain reminds me of my left leaning friends who think I'm too conservative and I hope he continues to post. I sympathize with his points because they have substance unlike the ludicrous right wing silliness of a slow website. I can't really dispute anything he writes except I don't think Monsanto will work itself although that's what I tell my liberal friends to get out if the conversation. I think Monsanto will make the Dust Bowl disaster seem like a strong wind. It's the beginning of the end of food production, I hope the future generations enjoy the green wafers Monsanto Corp will start handing out, hopefully I'll be the wafer when that time comes.
Fair enough. My reply:
I don't put my faith in US Government officials to determine who is / is not a piece of crap. They're just as likely to pick you or me - or my Mom, a radical senior citizen.
Planning to kill / already killed? Come on, how about the Tobacco mafia? They will without a doubt kill far more 'merikans over the next 1,3,5,10 years than any "terrorists". Life is life, death is death. All humans are equal in this great tabulation, nobody is exempt or counts more or less.
Agree on #1. And I love Canada. I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Canada.
Agree on #2. TCO models for renewable energy are favorable if you could convince Joe Sixpack that the cost of middle eastern light crude should rightfully be encumbered with the US military expenditures necessary to keep it flowing. China and Japan get a free ride at Joe Sixpack's expense - and that must stop, at least for China.
#3 - I don't want to let Washington, DC determine who are the good guys and who are the bad guys. Advertising usually has negative rates of return, but somehow it works. No doubt Americans would pay to watch actual deaths, especially PPV, but note that violent video games don't sell especially well outside of the USA.
I don't put my faith in US Government officials to determine who is / is not a piece of crap. They're just as likely to pick you or me - or my Mom, a radical senior citizen.
Planning to kill / already killed? Come on, how about the Tobacco mafia? They will without a doubt kill far more 'merikans over the next 1,3,5,10 years than any "terrorists". Life is life, death is death. All humans are equal in this great tabulation, nobody is exempt or counts more or less.
Agree on #1. And I love Canada. I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Canada.
Agree on #2. TCO models for renewable energy are favorable if you could convince Joe Sixpack that the cost of middle eastern light crude should rightfully be encumbered with the US military expenditures necessary to keep it flowing. China and Japan get a free ride at Joe Sixpack's expense - and that must stop, at least for China.
#3 - I don't want to let Washington, DC determine who are the good guys and who are the bad guys. Advertising usually has negative rates of return, but somehow it works. No doubt Americans would pay to watch actual deaths, especially PPV, but note that violent video games don't sell especially well outside of the USA.
Islamic terrorists (let's agree to be more precise than just calling them: religious fanatics) would like to see the end of western civilization, I agree. However they've never developed the killing tools to actually end western civilization due to their preference for a nomadic, anti-intellectual life of hanging out with other guys with equally unkempt facial hair, avoiding intoxicants that might offer an opportunity for enlightenment and honest self-reflection, plus their ongoing need to fuck goats and sheep, rather than cultivating the talents of the female half of Islam.
Net-net: the USA is and will always be reasonably safe from Islamic terrorists, and other risks such as tobacco, automobile accidents, etc. will always be an order of magnitude greater.
Drink some pure Norweigan fish oil every day, and eat a cheap laboratory manufactured multivitamin made in India. The fish oil is available from Amazon and the vitamins are available anywhere. Your body will be far more mathematically resilient to all the other garbage you must intake than any of our forbearers or contemporaries.
Monsanto is utterly detested in the non-English speaking world. In the few non-English speaking countries where it has made some progress, Monsanto is in no way ascending:
Brazil
http://www.gmwatch.org/index.php/ne...e-rules-in-favour-of-farmers-against-monsanto
South Africa
http://allafrica.com/stories/201305290260.html
Various Images
https://www.google.com/search?q=mon...C_sQTa8IDQBA&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1191&bih=869
Net-net: the USA is and will always be reasonably safe from Islamic terrorists, and other risks such as tobacco, automobile accidents, etc. will always be an order of magnitude greater.
Drink some pure Norweigan fish oil every day, and eat a cheap laboratory manufactured multivitamin made in India. The fish oil is available from Amazon and the vitamins are available anywhere. Your body will be far more mathematically resilient to all the other garbage you must intake than any of our forbearers or contemporaries.
Monsanto is utterly detested in the non-English speaking world. In the few non-English speaking countries where it has made some progress, Monsanto is in no way ascending:
Brazil
http://www.gmwatch.org/index.php/ne...e-rules-in-favour-of-farmers-against-monsanto
South Africa
http://allafrica.com/stories/201305290260.html
Various Images
https://www.google.com/search?q=mon...C_sQTa8IDQBA&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1191&bih=869
Mr. T, Monsanto is detested in English speaking countries too. My point is where does their peers wee end, they are destroying the food chain of our ecosystem and I believe nothing will be Monsanto safe in a shorter time then expected. I'd you read some of my H&F posts you can read I have some knowledge in alternative medicine. The problem is Monsanto has the power to seize any farm that uses even one of their products thanks to this Republican pushed legisistation, they are as powerful as Exxon, completely untouchable and without any accountability.
Evening primrose oil is more benifical then fish oil but we are not permitted to know if Monsanto manufactures it. I think Hemp is the future, high in Omega 3 and hopefully will resist Monsanto, the brat horticulturists in the world grow cannibis, the hide in indoor greenhouses and their skills of cultivation are so advanced. Fish Oil is not a vegan alternative. I've done lies of research on raw carrier oils, I think many small herb farms have kept under Monsanto's radar.
Mr. T., are you concerned with the religious fanatics that are running the Republican party? I believe their oppressive social views and desire to enforce biblical law is just as scary and they have real money and official lawmaking power. They are not afraid of popular opinion, my proof is they shut down our government costing 25 billion despite opposition from the public snd all over their twisted and innaccurare obsession over birth control, I don't believe they have boundaries or sanity. Cruz is trying to run out the few left that have some sanity, he is a dangerous man.
The Keystone is a scam, they want to use our land and Koch's refineries to send the finishes product to the global market. I don't trust them and until all that will profit appear under oath that we will be compensated, they are just schemers lying so a very few can become wealthy enough to buy our government. They have no clean up plan, they can't even contain the two latest tar sands spills. It amazes me the concern of Steve that people have to change to better insurance plans but the displacement and environment damage from this pipeline doesn't bother him at all. If its so safe let the pipeline go through Canada, America is not for the Koch's to use as their personal property, this is a democracy not their private playground to destroy so they can make another couple of trillion. Canada doesn't care because all the risk is on American soil. I don't want our country used but then again unlike conservatives I love my country and want it preserved for future generations instead of being a sludge wasteland.
Well if they don't kill with drones then they will just use tomohawk missiles or send in jets or some elite group like the seals. The drones are cheaper and don't risk US lives. I will go with the drones over the other alternatives.
Honestly ... there is no winning any fight in the middle east. People have tried since the days of the crusades. The only way to win is to get out and have nothing to do with them. What do they have that we want or need? Cocaine and oil.
It is amazing to me how much better off this country would be by maximizing our own resources. We can work on nuclear power, solar and green energy while we drill our country for natural gas and oil. It is just so stupid not to do so.
Honestly ... there is no winning any fight in the middle east. People have tried since the days of the crusades. The only way to win is to get out and have nothing to do with them. What do they have that we want or need? Cocaine and oil.
It is amazing to me how much better off this country would be by maximizing our own resources. We can work on nuclear power, solar and green energy while we drill our country for natural gas and oil. It is just so stupid not to do so.